Question about paint/white/black silkie genetics

[Elliemae1984]

I’d love some opinions on how I ended up with so many white silkie chicks! (Not complaining, just confused!)

I have a black hen, white hen, paint roo and black (with silver leakage) roo in one coop. This was my first hatch with this coop - I set 13 eggs, 6 from one hen and 7 from the other (not sure which was which, but I collected the 13 eggs over 7 days so I know the split was almost even).

One egg quit early, 12 chicks hatched. They were:
- 1 black
- 2 paint
- 1 blue
- 1 partridge mix
- 1 splash (maybe, this one passed still with its chick down, was very light grey so I assume splash)
- 6 white

I’m assuming my white is recessive, so she’d be responsible for the blue, partridge and (maybe) splash. The black would have laid the black and 2 paints. Chicks are 3-4 weeks old now and none of the 6 white chicks are feathering out with any paint spots.

So that would mean my black also laid 3-4 white? Is that possible? I thought black and paint parents would hatch 50/50 black and paint chicks. How (genetically speaking) would my black hen lay 50% white chicks? Or are some of the whites actually paints in disguise lol?

 

[Kiki]

@The Moonshiner Can you help?

 

[The Moonshiner]

I’d love some opinions on how I ended up with so many white silkie chicks! (Not complaining, just confused!)

I have a black hen, white hen, paint roo and black (with silver leakage) roo in one coop. This was my first hatch with this coop - I set 13 eggs, 6 from one hen and 7 from the other (not sure which was which, but I collected the 13 eggs over 7 days so I know the split was almost even).

One egg quit early, 12 chicks hatched. They were:
- 1 black
- 2 paint
- 1 blue
- 1 partridge mix
- 1 splash (maybe, this one passed still with its chick down, was very light grey so I assume splash)
- 6 white

I’m assuming my white is recessive, so she’d be responsible for the blue, partridge and (maybe) splash. The black would have laid the black and 2 paints. Chicks are 3-4 weeks old now and none of the 6 white chicks are feathering out with any paint spots.

So that would mean my black also laid 3-4 white? Is that possible? I thought black and paint parents would hatch 50/50 black and paint chicks. How (genetically speaking) would my black hen lay 50% white chicks? Or are some of the whites actually paints in disguise lol?

Sounds like you understand paints and how those genetics work.
I see a few ways to explain the whites.
Paints can be completely white. Seems unlikely that many would be though.
If you have a blue chick and may have had a splash chick the whites may be blue or splash paints so you're not noticing the splotches. Blue can be fairly light blue.
All your adults could easily be carrying recessive white. One copy hides completely. If your one hen is white and recessive white and your rooster carries recessive white. Then on average 50% of those chicks would be completely white. If your black hen carries it and your rooster does 25% would be white.
Your white hen could be recessive white but also carry dominate white. One or two copies. If so with a paint rooster you could easily get a lot of double gene dominate white chicks.
Or your white hen I guess could be dominate white and not recessive white at all.

 

[Elliemae1984]

Sounds like you understand paints and how those genetics work.
I see a few ways to explain the whites.
Paints can be completely white. Seems unlikely that many would be though.
If you have a blue chick and may have had a splash chick the whites may be blue or splash paints so you're not noticing the splotches. Blue can be fairly light blue.
All your adults could easily be carrying recessive white. One copy hides completely. If your one hen is white and recessive white and your rooster carries recessive white. Then on average 50% of those chicks would be completely white. If your black hen carries it and your rooster does 25% would be white.
Your white hen could be recessive white but also carry dominate white. One or two copies. If so with a paint rooster you could easily get a lot of double gene dominate white chicks.
Or your white hen I guess could be dominate white and not recessive white at all.

Thank you for this explanation!

I had no idea that black can carry a recessive white gene!!

 

[Chicks n stuff]

I’d love some opinions on how I ended up with so many white silkie chicks! (Not complaining, just confused!)

I have a black hen, white hen, paint roo and black (with silver leakage) roo in one coop. This was my first hatch with this coop - I set 13 eggs, 6 from one hen and 7 from the other (not sure which was which, but I collected the 13 eggs over 7 days so I know the split was almost even).

One egg quit early, 12 chicks hatched. They were:
- 1 black
- 2 paint
- 1 blue
- 1 partridge mix
- 1 splash (maybe, this one passed still with its chick down, was very light grey so I assume splash)
- 6 white

I’m assuming my white is recessive, so she’d be responsible for the blue, partridge and (maybe) splash. The black would have laid the black and 2 paints. Chicks are 3-4 weeks old now and none of the 6 white chicks are feathering out with any paint spots.

So that would mean my black also laid 3-4 white? Is that possible? I thought black and paint parents would hatch 50/50 black and paint chicks. How (genetically speaking) would my black hen lay 50% white chicks? Or are some of the whites actually paints in disguise lol?

So you have a black hen, white hen, paint roo and black (with silver leakage) roo

Black=E(dominant black)
Paint=E(dominant black) + (I/i+) one copy of dominant white
Solid white=
1. E(dominant black) + I/I two copies of dominant white
2. E(dominant black) + I/i+ two copies of dominant white, just didn't leak black
3. Two copies of c/c(recessive white) and recessive white covers red and black pigments so a recessive white can be any foundation color.

I/I can still leak black(it's just very unlikely)
I/i+ can and is commonly solid white(it's actually really hard to breed in good black leak into your paints).

A black hen x black rooster = black chicks, unless they carry a recessive black dilution gene, like lavender, or they carry eb(partridge), or recessive white.

A black hen x paint(black I/i+ one copy of dominant white) rooster = 50% paint, 50% black. And of course they could be carrying a recessive black diluter, or recessive white, or your hen and rooster could both have at least one eb(partridge) foundation gene each.

White hen(if she is c/c) x paint(black I/i+ one copy of dominant white) rooster = 50% will get one copy of dominant white and 50% will likely be black, because a paint silkie is black, the only exception would be if the parents were carrying other foundation colors recessively, or a black dilution gene.

White hen(if she is I/I) x paint rooster = 50% (I/I) 50% (I/i+).

White hen(if she is I/I) x black rooster = 100% (I/i+).

White hen(if she is c/c) x black rooster= black chicks, unless the rooster is carrying recessive white, or the hen and rooster have the genes for (eb)partridge, and the white hen must be Bl(blue).

One egg quit early, 12 chicks hatched. They were:
- 1 black(could be any one of your chickens offspring).
- 2 paint(these are likely from your black hen and your paint rooster).
- 1 blue(your white hen is blue or splash under her white and this chick is hers).
- 1 partridge mix(one of your hen and one of your roosters has eb(partridge)).
- 1 light gray(probably Bl(blue) this is also your white hen's offspring).
- 6 white, (I/I or I/i+ or c/c).

Recessive white is not necessarily involved at all, it's simply hasn't been ruled out. But if any of the white chicks get so much as a single black or red or any other color feather then they are dominant white. Recessive white doesn't leak color at all, (c/c)(c stands for colorless).

I’d love some opinions on how I ended up with so many white silkie chicks! (Not complaining, just confused!)

I have a black hen, white hen, paint roo and black (with silver leakage) roo in one coop. This was my first hatch with this coop - I set 13 eggs, 6 from one hen and 7 from the other (not sure which was which, but I collected the 13 eggs over 7 days so I know the split was almost even).

One egg quit early, 12 chicks hatched. They were:
- 1 black
- 2 paint
- 1 blue
- 1 partridge mix
- 1 splash (maybe, this one passed still with its chick down, was very light grey so I assume splash)
- 6 white

I’m assuming my white is recessive, so she’d be responsible for the blue, partridge and (maybe) splash. The black would have laid the black and 2 paints. Chicks are 3-4 weeks old now and none of the 6 white chicks are feathering out with any paint spots.

So that would mean my black also laid 3-4 white? Is that possible? I thought black and paint parents would hatch 50/50 black and paint chicks. How (genetically speaking) would my black hen lay 50% white chicks? Or are some of the whites actually paints in disguise lol?

You "have a black hen, white hen, paint roo and black (with silver leakage) roo in one coop. This was my first hatch with this coop - I set 13 eggs, 6 from one hen and 7 from the other (not sure which was which, but I collected the 13 eggs over 7 days so I know the split was almost even)."

Foundation color is determined by the 10 E locus series base colors. Poultry Genetics.

The E locus genes, in order of most dominant to most recessive. Genes: E, ER, ER-Fay, eWh, e+, eb, es, ebc, ey, eq.

E(dominant black), ER(birchen), ER- Fay(fayoumi birchen), eWh(dominant Wheaten), e+(duckwing/wild type), eb(partridge/brown), es(speckled), ebc(buttercup), ey(recessive wheaton), eq(queen silvia).

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/WFMeCwLq3ritrgt9/?mibextid=WC7FNe

Foundation color

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/kyNFGgLCxa2tWmTn/?mibextid=WC7FNe

The most common foundation colors are; E, ER, eWh, e+, eb, ey.

The most common foundation colors for silkies: E, eb, and very rarely ER.

https://www.facebook.com/share/yU9FEBhuoFMRRshT/?mibextid=WC7FNe

Because chromosomes come in pairs all chickens have two foundation genes. For example: (E/E), or (E/eb). But NOT (eb/E) As (E/E) would be a black chicken, and (E/eb) would also be a black chicken. (eb/eb) would be partridge. E(dominant black) is dominant to all other foundation colors and cannot be carried recessively.

Secondary color genes:

https://www.facebook.com/share/tzDUdHypov4m4vA5/?mibextid=WC7FNe

Your four silkie chickens: black hen, paint rooster, black rooster with silver leaks and a white hen.

Black hen: E/?(dominant black)

Paint rooster: E/?(dominant black) I/i+(dominant white) but just one copy

Black rooster with silver leaks: E/?(dominant black) S/S(silver), if the silver is a bit yellowed he could be S/s+(silver)/(carrying gold)

White hen: three most likely options;

1. I/I(dominant white)?
2. I/i+(paint with no black leaks)?
3. c/c(recessive white)?

If your white hen is (c/c) then she could be E/?(dominant black) or eb/eb(partridge), because recessive white covers both black and red pigment.

If your hen is dominant white then she would have to be black, because dominant white doesn't cover red/warm toned pigment. For example, a Buff Laced Polish, is just a Gold Laced Polish that has dominant white turning all the black lacing white. And this is the only one of your chickens that could be Bl/bl+(blue) or Bl/Bl(splash).

"One egg quit early, 12 chicks hatched. They were:

- 1 black (E/?)

- 2 paint (E/?, I/i+)

- 1 blue (E/?, Bl/bl+)

- 1 partridge mix (eb/eb)

- 1 splash (maybe, this one passed still with its chick down, was very light grey so I assume splash)(not possible to make a splash with the chickens you have, and splash chicks are pretty much white in color)(they could be a light blue which is likely, or you have a hen and rooster that carrying lav(lavender), lavender is recessive blue, and it's usually pretty light) but, splash would be (E/?, Bl/Bl) and lavender would be (E/?, lav/lav) and blue would be (E/?, Bl/bl+).

Splash silkies

https://www.mypetchicken.com/products/baby-chicks-splash-silkies

- 6 white" could be (I/I or I/i+ or c/c) I have a black silkie rooster over three paint silkie hens and I get a lot of I/i+ chicks that don't have any black leakage, it's actually really common to have I/i+ chicks with no visible black leakage. If they are dominant white (E/?, I/I or I/i+), if they're recessive white (E/?, or eb/eb, c/c).