Dumb chicks....again!

[Lil Biddie]

This is my 2nd try with TSC turkey poults and I'm having the same problem. They won't eat. They peck and drop the game starter crumbles, so I ran some thru the blender and it's the same behavior. It's like they don't know how to swallow? I'm not sure who TSCs supplier is or I would reach out to them as well. I've heard it was Ideal? At the rate they're going with turkeys, not just my personal experience, they're a BIG $ Maker for them! Send chicks that'll die and TSC covers nothing. Only customer loses the chicks who lose their lives? I'm up to 5 dead this year.
And, Yes....they're with chicks that eat, but only want to attack the chicks?!? I've seen them pick up granules of food to only shake it off their beak. ;/ Idk.
But, I do know 1 thing. IF I don't get them eating within 3 days they'll die and I'll be up to 4&% in loses and we don't do loses. Oh no.
But, we do take on challenges and Turkeys seem to be mine this year. Gotta say, Bob Whites were easier!
Any help, even down to how to tube feed them would be welcome. I don't want to lose these birds.
Thanks!

 

[nuthatched]

It's not the hatchery or tscs fault your birds are not eating.
Try making a mash by mixing some water and warming it up. Some boiled egg yolk might tempt them.
Seperate the non eaters, they may be aggressive and distracted by the others.

 

[Lil Biddie]

It's not the hatchery or tscs fault your birds are not eating.
Try making a mash by mixing some water and warming it up. Some boiled egg yolk might tempt them.
Seperate the non eaters, they may be aggressive and distracted by the others.

Thanks for the reply. They do seem to be aggressive to other chicks and peck only at them or the walls or legs of the brooder heater! I've seen them pick up bits of crumble only to shake it off like it's Nasty!
Otherwise all they do is sleep.
I figure I've got less than 2 days to get them intaking calories. They'll run out of yolk energy and it's over. Again.

 

[Lil Biddie]

It's not the hatchery or tscs fault your birds are not eating.
Try making a mash by mixing some water and warming it up. Some boiled egg yolk might tempt them.
Seperate the non eaters, they may be aggressive and distracted by the others.

Are they born with cocci, because I've never had that in birds...Yest. But, I saw one squirt. It's not a good sign. I have amprolium, but have seldome used it. It turns out that cocci is species specific and the kittens I was fostering hadn't improved and I tried that because I was so sick of shit! I wanted them FIXED with the meds provided and that didn't work, so I tried that. I sent them back, but told my Vet about it and he laughed and apologized because he knew I'd try anything before admitting defeat.

I'm at that pint with these 2nd round try of turkeys.
I'm good with birds...for the most part. I could use a hand fixating a club foot and a splay leg chick, but hose are unrelated. But, since you're wondering, one was bought from TSC and the other was a bad hatch. It's a silkie...I can't kill it. Yet.
I may have to. 2 club feet and a splayed leg.....really bad hatch.

It's not the hatchery or tscs fault your birds are not eating.
Try making a mash by mixing some water and warming it up. Some boiled egg yolk might tempt them.
Seperate the non eaters, they may be aggressive and distracted by the others.

To be sure that I'm understanding you correctly....separate the turkeys from birds that they're aggressive towards? They don't even like each other!
I did pull the other chicks out on your advice. It wasn't a hard decision. They all were sleeping.
See, the thing is that on many chicks you can see if they're eating and others9floofy) you can feel if they've got food in the gullet. Even quail. These turkeys are still on E... the Engine light's on for them. I've not even seen them initiate drinking water on their own. I wish I had some springtails. It's a ground insect that moves and they do seem attracted to movement. Damned shame my broody hen got up. But, I have 2 more. If it fails, I'm out another $30.

 

[R2elk]

Are they born with cocci, because I've never had that in birds...Yest. But, I saw one squirt. It's not a good sign. I have amprolium, but have seldom used it. It turns out that cocci is species specific

Amprolium won't do anything for cocci. It is used to treat coccidiosis. Amprolium is a a thiamine blocker. Thiamine is essential to the development and growth of turkey poults.

You are the one introducing coccidiosis to your poults. You have it on your property. Keeping the poults off of the ground can be helpful.

Just a friendly reminder on coccidiosis vs cocci

 

[R2elk]

Poults and chicks are born with entirely different instincts. Do not confuse instincts with intelligence. Turkeys can learn.

There are a number of different threads about how people teach their poults how to eat. I don't. Poults have the instinct to peck at things on the ground. I live on a sand dune so I use the free sand for my brooder bedding. I sprinkle 30% protein turkey or game bird starter on the sand. I have found good turkey starters to have a larger crumb size than turkey grower which makes it easier for the poults to see the particles on the sand bedding.

My poults are usually eating within 15 minutes of being placed in the brooder. It make take them as many as 3 days to realize that the stuff in the feeder is food too. I keep sprinkling the starter on the bedding until I see poults eating from the feeder.

I dip each poult's beak in the water the first time I put them in the brooder. I do not seem to have any problems using this method to get them eating and drinking.

I do not recommend brooding poults with anything but poults. The imprinting that happens can have bad results later on.

 

[Lil Biddie]

Are they born with cocci, because I've never had that in birds...Yest. But, I saw one squirt. It's not a good sign. I have amprolium, but have seldome used it. It turns out that cocci is species specific and the kittens I was fostering hadn't improved and I tried that because I was so sick of shit! I wanted them FIXED with the meds provided and that didn't work, so I tried that. I sent them back, but told my Vet about it and he laughed and apologized because he knew I'd try anything before admitting defeat.

I'm at that pint with these 2nd round try of turkeys.
I'm good with birds...for the most part. I could use a hand fixating a club foot and a splay leg chick, but hose are unrelated. But, since you're wondering, one was bought from TSC and the other was a bad hatch. It's a silkie...I can't kill it. Yet.
I may have to. 2 club feet and a splayed leg.....really bad hatch.

To be sure that I'm understanding you correctly....separate the turkeys from birds that they're aggressive towards? They don't even like each other!
I did pull the other chicks out on your advice. It wasn't a hard decision. They all were sleeping.
See, the thing is that on many chicks you can see if they're eating and others9floofy) you can feel if they've got food in the gullet. Even quail. These turkeys are still on E... the Engine light's on for them. I've not even seen them initiate drinking water on their own. I wish I had some springtails. It's a ground insect that moves and they do seem attracted to movement. Damned shame my broody hen got up. But, I have 2 more. If it fails, I'm out another $30.

Now, I'm wondering if i over reacted? It just really sux when you lose a bird. It's like a Challenge to et it Right and you feel like you're failing and lives are literally at stake!
I took your advice and moved all of the bigger chicks out of that box leaving them with the 2 ....Nekked necks! that they came in with. I just can't cll them turkens. I have 2 half breeds and they're sweet birds...but Not pretty! But, that's ok. I have plenty of pretty but untouchable around me that I can appreciate personality over beauty.
Anyhoo....last time I peeked in I saw one mimicking the chick eating. But, I'm not fooled by that. I won't be fooled again! It's not eating. I saw the other drink water...maybe? It made the motions.
I've never had cocci with my birds. I don't use medicated feeds because there's no reason. I have amprolium but I hesitate to use it because od the vitamins it stops from absorption. It's one of those that's good to keep on hand, but never use. Turns out that's not the one for cats. Cocci is species specific...which might explain why the kittens were so pissed, but I kept trying and kept them alive. The next Foster lost them all. Which was what I was afraid of. Idk how cocci can be so invasive so such young kittens and so resistant to treatment.
But, Idk how turkey chicks can be so stupid as to not want to eat either. I have half a mind to try and sneak them under a broody hen.

Poults and chicks are born with entirely different instincts. Do not confuse instincts with intelligence. Turkeys can learn.

There are a number of different threads about how people teach their poults how to eat. I don't. Poults have the instinct to peck at things on the ground. I live on a sand dune so I use the free sand for my brooder bedding. I sprinkle 30% protein turkey or game bird starter on the sand. I have found good turkey starters to have a larger crumb size than turkey grower which makes it easier for the poults to see the particles on the sand bedding.

My poults are usually eating within 15 minutes of being placed in the brooder. It make take them as many as 3 days to realize that the stuff in the feeder is food too. I keep sprinkling the starter on the bedding until I see poults eating from the feeder.

I dip each poult's beak in the water the first time I put them in the brooder. I do not seem to have any problems using this method to get them eating and drinking.

I do not recommend brooding poults with anything but poults. The imprinting that happens can have bad results later on.

I don't have cocci problems and don't need to buy medicated feed. I do have amprolium on hand.
And, youre sure right. these are dumber than Bob Whites whom I've found to be idiots. But, kept them alive anyhow. But, Turkeys? You put their beak in the water and I see them swallow. Dip thier beak in the crumbles and all they want to fo is peck the food off the others beaks! Not eat the food beneath their feet! Pecker heads!
You know how you can feel if chicks eaten by feeling it's ? craw? I feel nothing and one of them actually regurgitated water. Which could be a good sign...or a sign that I pressed too hard! Eeeks!
I'm doing my best and I so, so much appreciate your assistance in this matter. It shouldn't be this hard! But, @ $14.99 a pop and I've already lost 3 I'm sure you understand why I'm reaching out.
In the scheme of Life this is small cracklins, but to them? It's a matter of Life and Death, so TY again for your assistance.

 

[R2elk]

I often see users refer to coccidiosis in chickens on the site and usually the terms "coccidiosis", "coccidia", and "cocci" are used as if they are one in the same. But they are actually two different organisms. I worked at a veterinary hospital for 10 years and have seen both.

So coccidia are a single celled parasite that normally infect the intestinal tract. I saw it a lot in kittens and puppies, only maybe 2 cases of an adult dog with it. We treated it with oral Albon suspension. This is what coccidia looks like under a microscope. Coccidiosis is a coccidia infection.

Ok, now for cocci. Cocci is a round, spherical shaped bacteria that's common in most animals, but sometimes they have an overgrowth which leads to issues. I saw it a lot in dogs and cats with ear infections, skin infections, and even in poop smears of diarrhea. Yes a poop smear is just what it sounds like. Smear some poop on a glass slide, heat fix it, stain it, look at said poop.
You treat an overgrowth of cocci differently than coccidia because they are two different organisms. Cocci is a bacteria. In GI infections we usually treated with Reglan to regulate gut motility and probiotics to regulate the growth of bad bacteria. After that and a week of eating a bland diet, most dogs (and cats) were back to normal. This is what cocci looks like under a microscope. This is actually a picture of staphylococcus, a type of cocci bacteria.

I hope this was helpful. I often see people talking about cocci and coccidiosis as if they are one in the same. I was thinking it would be bad if someone were trying to treat for coccidiosis perhaps, and use a treatment for cocci, not knowing they were two different things.


Treslilbirds

If you have cocci, Amprolium will not do anything for it. Amprolium is a thiamine blocker that is used to treat coccidiosis which is caused by coccidia.

 

[R2elk]

You know how you can feel if chicks eaten by feeling it's ? craw?

Poults are not chicks. I see chicks and adult chickens with their bulging crops from eating. I do not see this in turkey poults or adult turkeys. Using this as your basis for your belief that your poults are not eating doesn't work.

I currently have two week old poults that I have not once seen with a bulging crop. Obviously they are eating and drinking because they are alive and growing.

My opinion is that you are causing your own problems. I dip each poult's beak in their water once when I put them in the brooder. I sprinkle 30% game bird or turkey starter on their sand bedding.

I have a temperature controller on the brooder heater set to automatically control the temperature at 90°F, measured at the bedding level, for the first week and lower it by 5°F each week until I get them down to the ambient temperature. I have a daylight bulb above the brooder which I turn on in the morning and off at night. Other than making sure they have warm water available and feed available, I leave them alone.

Turkey poults learn quite well. You are the one teaching your poults by constantly interfering with them thereby causing them to ignore their instincts in favor of doing what they perceive you want them to do. They imprint very easily and learn very quickly to crave the attention that you are giving them.

 

[Lil Biddie]

I read this and had to sit on it a while to digest what you're trying to tell me.
It's possible that you're showing off with all of the specific equipment you mention.
I'm not that Fancy. I still have to hand turn eggs in an old round galvanized metal incubator. I tried a new plastic one and it didn't turn the eggs...just slid them around.
My last hatch was out of 99 eggs, 10 were infertile and 84 Bob White hatched. So, I know a little about birds. And, their Instincts! Don't make me laugh. Most have been bred out so they could tolerate Humans!
Of those 84 quail I hatched I lost 10 on the 4th day. They didn't learn to eat. The other 74 did, so Instinct or did I teach 74 quail and failed 10? You're the Expert, you tell me.
I will agree with you on these turkeys...They like me. My chicks like me, too! They run out of feed or the water gets clogged with shavings they call and, I can tell the difference in their peeps..and I go tend to them. One gets accustomed to happy chatter and the OTHER sounds that require attention. Not my 1st Rodeo, nor my 1st species, but I can always learn more!
So, although I found your post patronizing at best, I did find some value in it and appreciate you sharing your experience with me. I'll do my best not to let the turkeys Imprint on me because FFS who needs turkeys as Stalkers?!? The Lavender Orpington is Way more stalker than I need! ) I swear she's sweet, but she always sees something on my leg!
And, I hope you don't find this offensive. It's not the spirit that I mean to convey. I AM constantly learning even at my age.
But, I don't feel that I'm incorrect in saying hatchery birds have little to no instinct left in them. My free range chicks brought up by a Broody have them, but their Mom was a Broody hen which most breeds are not. I wish I could've snuck those turckys under a broody, but the timing wasn't right and @ $14.99 each how willing would you be to turn them loose into the wild? After the last3 chicks that failed to learn to eat...I wouldn't have chanced it even if I had the opportunity. Seriously. $14.99 for a chick? You know I'm not raising them for the meat!