How do I treat E coli - narrowed it down on my pet, Mary (fecal clear)

[Warrior Creek]

So, I did take a fecal sample in for Mary and it was clear. The vet techs ran it and older DVM out of town. He had given me 3 days of 100 mg of Baytil (called something w an E generic) IM). She had been pounced on by a puppy and was our first thought,

But he hadn’t seen her loose, clear, bright green stools. She’s drinking and hydrating fine.

i have a DVM in PA that I text and she said salmonella and I’m researching Ptsossis also. So I had 100 mg Doxcycline capsules I put in yogurt via syringe for 3 days, before I got Oxytet and did 1.1 ml IM 3 days w Meloxicam both DVMs said was ok in moderation, because she acted like she had a migraine headache and pitiful in her nest.

She really perked up and acted more interested in food, but still not really eating and while the techs said her fecal was clear, DUH - it hits me -

E coli!!!!!!!! 0157:H7 makes perfect sense. Symptoms and while my wellhead has been flushed, we live down from a cattle feed lot, with no sedimentation pond I have been doing public speaking about, because this bacteria is rampant in my county and she’s not protected free ranging in the creek and lower field (especially when we go on long walks). She’s a “pecker head,” after all and it’s probably built up in her system.

So guys, other than boiling her water first to rid of bacteria, what’s my immediate treatment? Poor little “pecker head.” She’s better, but pooh isn’t better.

i sent the tag to Cargil also, because there was a salmonella outbreak and major recall in Southern States horse feed last year from the same plant where the 28% Sporting Bird feed is also manufactured just in case it was included in the 2020 recall and Dr Papp from PA us right. She talked about success with fecal transplants. And I’m like, what? No avian DVMs local and we’re guessing.

 

[iwltfum]

This birds gut is probably out of whack due to the miriad of antibiotics you've given to her. I would say give her some healthy feed, clean bedding and water, shelter, and wait a few days. Soil kills salmonella in a matter of hours so I would venture a guess that unless your turkey has been eating raw poultry or if it was in your feed bag from cargil, salmonella is probably not the issue.

 

[Warrior Creek]

This birds gut is probably out of whack due to the miriad of antibiotics you've given to her. I would say give her some healthy feed, clean bedding and water, shelter, and wait a few days. Soil kills salmonella in a matter of hours so I would venture a guess that unless your turkey has been eating raw poultry or if it was in your feed bag from cargil, salmonella is probably not the issue.

I agree on the salmonella issue, except we have had flood waters from a farm, where they spread poultry litter on the fields and actually feed it to the cattle in a feedlot. It's an acceptable USDA practice called "nutrient rich feces." We have had heavy spring rains and I live on a flood plain. She has free ranged in that area. It's the only way she has come into contact with anything like that. However, we do have an issue with e-coli or fecal coliform below this farm and others in my county below commercial poultry farms and cattle feed lots. My wellhead has been flushed / sanitized, but she could have come into contact with it free ranging.

She lives on my raising porch and has fresh shaving weekly and new straw for her nest. I gave the antibiotics at the instruction of veterinarians. And stopped on Friday, because I do not want to overdo it.

I did go get another feed to make sure she has her usual umpteen options of several things to eat. I change her feed out everyday. She's very wasteful and I'm over indulgent of my very spoiled turkey.

I told the vet with avian experience in PA that I text and helps me, the only birds are wild and not enough to do anything. I was giving the cardinals her food she was wasting, because she "does sing for songbird seed and sun flower seeds." They are a limited treat with can corn.

No raw chicken or poultry in sight. But, all I can think of it they top dressed the fields and it flooded, which maybe she got a double whammy of e-coli. She's an only bird and the feed has probably been at the Southern States dealer since last year, when they did have a recall. She's just picking right now and going to work on getting some probiotics in her.

I had just read possibly Albon or sulpha drugs would help her. I would never give anything without instructions from a DVM. I'm really good with horses, but learning w birds. But, seems like we are on our own and I'm so thankful for this forum. She hasn't had anything since last weekend. Just another train of thought since her fecal was clear.

 

[Warrior Creek]

We only treated her aggressively, because she was gravely ill and on her nest. She had not eaten in five days and acted like she had a migraine headache. She had also been pounced on by my neighbor's new puppy and the pup had taken out some blood feathers. Darn neighbors didn't take care of the other ones and I seem to be their DVM for the dogs. Have electric poultry fencing on the way from Iowa to fry that puppy, because the other dog that helps protect my property is a previous Mexican chicken flock protector. The only thing I can think of is e-coli in the water that makes perfect sense or perhaps in that "cake they top dress with," I know 'through the grapevine that poultry farm doesn't incinerate their dead birds. Everything goes in that compost pile. I'm trying to get them to put in a sedmintation pond below the feed lot, but that doesn't help with top dressing the organic working feeds for their corn they produce. They are good farmers and bacteria is going to happen, along with heavy spring rains. They have 14,000 acres above me and it all drains downhill to my creek. They are excellent farmers, except not putting in the lagoon, but Division of Water Quality only makes them pass inspection one time a year. It's just a surface water thing and bacteria is organic. It's going to happen.

 

[iwltfum]

Yowza. You have alot of commercial livestock around you huh? You're suspicions about those near by farms could have some merit if they are as flagrant about biosecurity and flood retention as you've stated. Really with commercial poultry bedding being dumped on a field that drains through your property, it could be any number of things that lurk around large scale poultry outfits. I wish I had better advise for you, but I am more of a "manage the birds healthfully and you will have a healthy flock" type of person, but sounds like you are up against some tough farming practices in terms of keeping bio-hazards out.

I used to manage an organic garden about 15 feet from the edge of a commercial alfalfa crop and when they sprayed herbicides, multiple times a year - with a 50 yard wide spray rig, it would make my blood boil watching all the spray completely miss the alfalfa and drift over my veggetables. Needless to say, not only did the crops grow terribly after getting hit with the overspray, but we couldn't even conscionably call the produce organic anymore. I found a new job in a different state within a year and half of dealing with that bs.

 

[Warrior Creek]

So guys ... all of you, especially experienced folks, Mary is not eating again and got “salmonella ish poo.” So frustrated.

This time, because she’s molted bad from her weight loss the first time, she’s slept on the couch. Yes, she’s a spoiled “house turkey.”

But I had changed her feed from Southern States 28 percent Sporting Bird Mix to DuMour 24% Medicated Chick Starter w Probiotics. And she improved greatly.

Southern States swears there’s nothing wrong w this batch, especially this batch. So I’m thinking she needs the extra protein + I started her on the Poultry Cell Saver.

We’ve not has much free range time and I’m w her 24/7 of that time. I know every move she makes, where she goes and where she pecks. I can’t say she’s been on my flood plain or in the creek. I even boil her water in advance.

i saw on another post to start Penicillin, or Amoxicillin. I don’t have those, but Doxycycline, Oxytet and a few others I got last time.

I’ve only only given her Acidophilus in yogurt syringe and another syringe of yogurt so far w no antibiotics. Everyone fussed at me about antibiotics last tome.

And as sick aa she was last time, her fecal was clean. It always is. No salmonella showed up. No parasites or anything. My long distance vet was guessing salmonella. If anything possibly rodent or I’m still thinking that darn Southern States feed, I’m now going to dump out. I don’t care what the rep aays.

i’m not feeding wild birds anymore. And only have one possum that eats in baxk of the house. She was onlt out there one day. So what antibiotic? What strength IM? What do you disinfect with on free range area?

 

[LateBirdFarms]

I don't know much about turkeys, but I know poop that colour is often a sign of starvation with chickens. Is tube feeding an option?

 

[Warrior Creek]

No. She just got to this today. And she’s been doing great, except for the molting. I thought it was seasonal, but now reading think brought on more by weight loss when she was sick before. I’m just asking husbandry questions on antibiotics, since I have a plethora of them. Just no Amoxicillin or penicillin. I can do IM w Doxycycline or put that in yogurt or do IM w it or Oxytet. My local vet is back off vacation, just not versed in birds. My other vet that is versed in birds said salmonella, but is in a different state.

i’m thinking it’s just an unhealthy gut and I don’t care what kind of “justification the Southern States rep gives,” this isn’t from wild birds. It’s from their Sporting bird crumble and I also need to disinfect the back pen, it’s 6 ft tall and had zero feed all winter in there. I need to disinfect it. But the rest of the time, she’s w me. I see everything that goes into this “peckerhead’s mouth.” She mostly drinks from her special sippy cup that I hold. I boil her water first. I will not let her go long without eating again. Started the yogurt w probiotics today. Need input on antibiotics from more experienced person.

 

[iwltfum]

You're keeping a turkey in the house. It needs to be outside in a clean, ventilated coop with fresh water and feed. What is even wrong with her? Her poop is a weird color? That could mean nothing. Sometimes turkey poop is weird. I dont mean to come off like an ass, but in my experience when you give birds the housing, proper food, ad clean water they need, they are healthy. And when you dont, they aren't healthy. I'm really not convinced there's even anything wrong with your turkey in the first place. If shes acting normal and is happy to go out for "free range time" there may very well be nothing wrong with her.

Edit for clairty: weird looking poop in poultry is something to watch closely and use as a sign to look for other symptoms, not something needs treated.

 

[Warrior Creek]

She’s only been inside a few nights that it got down to late freezing temps, because she molted almost all her feathers. She has an excellent environment. Her poop got runny again, clear and slimy again. Her avian DVM from PA diagnosed it over a month ago visually as “salmonella looking,” when she was very ill and didn’t eat for over a week. I thought e coli, due to a cattle feed lot above us on the creek that affects my flood plain and well. And we had been down there, free ranging. She gets plenty of exercise and has a wonderful life.

But the I think her Southern States 28 percent Sporting bird feed is the culprit, although the rep assured me it wasn’t a bad batch number and said she could have gotten it from me feeding wild birds.

After two yogurt syringes, one w probiotics, she does have an appetite this morning, but I don’t want her trending in a downward spiral again after the last round of salmonella / e coli, or whatever.

I’m asking 1) what antibiotics do you guys dose your birds w for salmonella, 2) disinfect yards with (can only think her pen in the back of my house might need it from “possibly a possum getting in there,” but it’s been locked up during the winter, because she had been free ranging, and wasn’t using it unless going out of town in warmer months,

I reiterate, I haven’t given her antibiotics yet. But my local DVM doesn’t really know birds or turkeys and just helps me w fecals and out of town most of the last time (although his techs said her fecal was normal). Wasn’t anything normal about how sick she was last time.