Mystery white chicken?

[CherieNZ]

Hi everyone, I had a beautiful rooster Whitie (sold now) that randomly popped out white/cream, pic's below. I've never had white pop up in my flock before. Besides a recessive white gene, I was wondering if anyone knew whether double Co and Db genes were enough to produce the white/cream seen here. Both parents of Whitie are a mix of Rhode Island Red, Legbar, and Moorhead Partridge Silkie, so there's a lot of modifying genes going on.
My personal guess is that this white was produced by Co (Columbian), Db (Dark Brown), and ig (Cream) genes. Any thoughts appreciated

 

[CherieNZ]

These are the parents:

 

[-Chanticleer-]

I don’t know much about genetics. He is a stunning bird maybe @NatJ has some insight?

 

[NatJ]

Hi everyone, I had a beautiful rooster Whitie (sold now) that randomly popped out white/cream, pic's below. I've never had white pop up in my flock before. Besides a recessive white gene, I was wondering if anyone knew whether double Co and Db genes were enough to produce the white/cream seen here. Both parents of Whitie are a mix of Rhode Island Red, Legbar, and Moorhead Partridge Silkie, so there's a lot of modifying genes going on.
My personal guess is that this white was produced by Co (Columbian), Db (Dark Brown), and ig (Cream) genes. Any thoughts appreciated

View attachment 3698977

I think he is probably recessive white. I do not think it is possible to get a chicken that pale with the combination of genes you suggest, but I do not know for sure.

I am pretty sure @nicalandia knows more than I do about those genes, so maybe he can help here.

 

[CherieNZ]

Thankyou both, much appreciated. One more thing I forgot to mention, was that Whitie likely had a barring gene too, which would also contribute to lightening. In the Kippenjungle chicken gene calculator, to create cream (not white though), double lots of eWh, Co, Db, and ig are needed. With the barring gene I wonder if it could have created Whitie's colouring?

 

[NatJ]

Thankyou both, much appreciated. One more thing I forgot to mention, was that Whitie likely had a barring gene too, which would also contribute to lightening. In the Kippenjungle chicken gene calculator, to create cream (not white though), double lots of eWh, Co, Db, and ig are needed. With the barring gene I wonder if it could have created Whitie's colouring?

View attachment 3699044

Barring should add white lines across whatever other color his feathers are showing. I would not expect it to lighten everything evenly.

Does the mother have barring? Because I certainly don't see it in the father. (Barring tends to be more obvious on dark colors than on light ones, which is why I am unsure about the mother.)

 

[NatJ]

Hi everyone, I had a beautiful rooster Whitie (sold now) that randomly popped out white/cream, pic's below. I've never had white pop up in my flock before.

If you hadn't sold him, you could probably have settled it by test-mating.

Breeding a recessive white rooster to his mother should produce 50% recessive white chicks and 50% other-colored chicks.

For the other gene combination you are suggesting, breeding him to his mother should produce chicks with many shades of gold/cream/white depending on which combinations of genes are inherited by each chick (not a 50/50 split of whites vs. everything else.)

 

[CherieNZ]

If you hadn't sold him, you could probably have settled it by test-mating.

Breeding a recessive white rooster to his mother should produce 50% recessive white chicks and 50% other-colored chicks.

For the other gene combination you are suggesting, breeding him to his mother should produce chicks with many shades of gold/cream/white depending on which combinations of genes are inherited by each chick (not a 50/50 split of whites vs. everything else.)

Thanks so much for the input. Yes the mum does appear to have barring (another pic below), as do many of her sisters and their babies. The barring almost looks like spangling on her and her sisters, which may be because of Db's influence?

Whitie does have barring on some of his feathers, but it's hard to spot even up close, because the cream/lemon is so pale.

Subsequent chicks from the same group (not born from Whitie) have been born with some white feathering, but no repeats of pure white/cream yet:

 

[NatJ]

Thanks so much for the input. Yes the mum does appear to have barring (another pic below), as do many of her sisters and their babies. The barring almost looks like spangling on her and her sisters, which may be because of Db's influence?

View attachment 3699069

Whitie does have barring on some of his feathers, but it's hard to spot even up close, because the cream/lemon is so pale.

Subsequent chicks from the same group (not born from Whitie) have been born with some white feathering, but no repeats of pure white/cream yet:

View attachment 3699071

This is definitely odd and interesting.

If both parents carry recessive white, then I would expect about 1/4 of chicks to be white (like Whitite), and I would not expect any chicks with the odd white patches (like the one you just posted.)

I see why you think this might be caused by some other combination of genes, but I just don't know what to say about it.

I can't immediately think of who else to tag for ideas, either.

 

[Amer]

He is definitely recessive white, probably inheriting it from his Legbar side and/or Silkie side.
He is quite beautiful.