Hi folks - We've been on a long journey here with a new family, lice + worms discovered, multiple treatments and ultimately no success.
An overly diligent and self-abnegating broody eventually hatched 5 of 7 eggs but developed lice, which were evidently secondary to worms. The lice was succesfully treated with permethrin and DE but then the flattish-white segments discovered in poop. There's a video on here somewhere of that type but I can't now find it; this site is huge.
First I treated the adults with praziquantel (via equimax). No chance did I underdose with this; I overdosed them but they survived (I, however, am mortified. Please let's not go into this ghastly mistake of mine).
10 days later I discover more of those worm segments. This time I treat according to @casportpony's excellent visual show of "pea" sizes (yes, I agree, it is a terribly misleading term which is why I appreciate the visuals not to mention the calculations which - I didn't screw up, but the actual translation to the syringe was my problem the first time). This second dose was with fenbendazole via safeguard horse dewormer.
Four days later the worms were back.
I haven't been able to determine precisely and reliably which hen produces the wormy poop. The trouble is that not all poops are wormy. And that the productive ones are usually later in the day, not earlier in it. [someone asserted, aggressively, it is easy to know and determine from which this emanates by watching in the morning as they come off the roost, but this isn't so here].
So then I went to the goat-liquid version of safeguard/fenbendazole. Just for the record, I far prefer this method - very easy to control, no rx-distribution issues of paste v liquid (which can be shaken well).
A vet-friend's vet-friend (if you follow) - who specializes in farm animals, said to dose at 100mg/kg. But on here someone suggested 5d x 50mg/kg so I decided to try that as more acute - you'd get that same high dose, more even, but spread out a little bit. Seemed maybe easier on the body but also maybe effective as a 1:2 on the worms?
And... everyone seemed happy _but_ .... I don't think the one is better. on d4 I still saw worms in one set of plop and then a bit after the finish of the treatment, but definitely lesser.
The problem is - also in reading someone asserts you can tell when there's a problem if the breastbone of the chicken is really prominent. And the one I suspect is affected definitely has a prominent breastbone. And appears a bit ratty even when it's not molting season. The peculiar thing is, she appears very healthy, charging around, being spirited, full, colorful crest. She is, however, exceptionally noisy - complaining. Is it possible she's telling me, constantly, she doesn't "feel well"? I dunno....
This morning that prominent breastbone I notice is actually rubbed bare of any feathers. And she's lighter still than ever. Still very hale, but I think she just isn't getting nutrition.
Is there another medication to try? I can try to confirm, again, that this is the hen with the acute problem (last time I cooped her up for a day to inspect her poop; she was not happy).
I could try, I guess, the 100mg/kg dose one-off that had been suggested. But is this enacting crazy, doing the same thing over and hoping for a different outcome? I mean, it's not precisely the same thing.... but resistance is real.
We live in SoCal. So - not hard frost, and - climate change is happening here too. It's not super-hot, we're near the ocean. But whereas once it was dry, now it is humid here nearly always. I know the worms live in damp soil and are purportedly killed by sunlight. I have been creeping around picking up poop. And their predator proof hutch does not get sunlight. I did rake it out and put in new bedding (I use bamboo leaves which I know is not likely to find favor here...). I had thought I had this under control until I discovered that, in fact, perhaps I have not.
Please any ideas? Thank you!!! There are several mavens here on the matter including @casportpony, @dawg53, @Wyorp Rock and so many others - sorry, not trying to diss anyone by not naming, I just cannot seem to find the threads I had been using earlier. Anyway, I value you-all's experience., I'd appreciate suggestions if anyone has any. As I said, this hardy hen doesn't seem all that badly off, but I actually, truly believe all this noise-making is her trying to tell me she feels as bad as her poop looks. And whereas formerly she was fine with my picking her up, she seems resistant now because perhaps all that bare skin hurts? Maybe I'm anthropomorphizing.... anyway, I would value suggestions please. TY.
Oh, one more thing I know the treatment is dependent on what worms are present. But I'm thinking there may be more than the flatish white segments I saw undulating. That at least is present but perhaps there are other things. I have looked and haven't found anything though.
Thanks again.
An overly diligent and self-abnegating broody eventually hatched 5 of 7 eggs but developed lice, which were evidently secondary to worms. The lice was succesfully treated with permethrin and DE but then the flattish-white segments discovered in poop. There's a video on here somewhere of that type but I can't now find it; this site is huge.
First I treated the adults with praziquantel (via equimax). No chance did I underdose with this; I overdosed them but they survived (I, however, am mortified. Please let's not go into this ghastly mistake of mine).
10 days later I discover more of those worm segments. This time I treat according to @casportpony's excellent visual show of "pea" sizes (yes, I agree, it is a terribly misleading term which is why I appreciate the visuals not to mention the calculations which - I didn't screw up, but the actual translation to the syringe was my problem the first time). This second dose was with fenbendazole via safeguard horse dewormer.
Four days later the worms were back.
I haven't been able to determine precisely and reliably which hen produces the wormy poop. The trouble is that not all poops are wormy. And that the productive ones are usually later in the day, not earlier in it. [someone asserted, aggressively, it is easy to know and determine from which this emanates by watching in the morning as they come off the roost, but this isn't so here].
So then I went to the goat-liquid version of safeguard/fenbendazole. Just for the record, I far prefer this method - very easy to control, no rx-distribution issues of paste v liquid (which can be shaken well).
A vet-friend's vet-friend (if you follow) - who specializes in farm animals, said to dose at 100mg/kg. But on here someone suggested 5d x 50mg/kg so I decided to try that as more acute - you'd get that same high dose, more even, but spread out a little bit. Seemed maybe easier on the body but also maybe effective as a 1:2 on the worms?
And... everyone seemed happy _but_ .... I don't think the one is better. on d4 I still saw worms in one set of plop and then a bit after the finish of the treatment, but definitely lesser.
The problem is - also in reading someone asserts you can tell when there's a problem if the breastbone of the chicken is really prominent. And the one I suspect is affected definitely has a prominent breastbone. And appears a bit ratty even when it's not molting season. The peculiar thing is, she appears very healthy, charging around, being spirited, full, colorful crest. She is, however, exceptionally noisy - complaining. Is it possible she's telling me, constantly, she doesn't "feel well"? I dunno....
This morning that prominent breastbone I notice is actually rubbed bare of any feathers. And she's lighter still than ever. Still very hale, but I think she just isn't getting nutrition.
Is there another medication to try? I can try to confirm, again, that this is the hen with the acute problem (last time I cooped her up for a day to inspect her poop; she was not happy).
I could try, I guess, the 100mg/kg dose one-off that had been suggested. But is this enacting crazy, doing the same thing over and hoping for a different outcome? I mean, it's not precisely the same thing.... but resistance is real.
We live in SoCal. So - not hard frost, and - climate change is happening here too. It's not super-hot, we're near the ocean. But whereas once it was dry, now it is humid here nearly always. I know the worms live in damp soil and are purportedly killed by sunlight. I have been creeping around picking up poop. And their predator proof hutch does not get sunlight. I did rake it out and put in new bedding (I use bamboo leaves which I know is not likely to find favor here...). I had thought I had this under control until I discovered that, in fact, perhaps I have not.
Please any ideas? Thank you!!! There are several mavens here on the matter including @casportpony, @dawg53, @Wyorp Rock and so many others - sorry, not trying to diss anyone by not naming, I just cannot seem to find the threads I had been using earlier. Anyway, I value you-all's experience., I'd appreciate suggestions if anyone has any. As I said, this hardy hen doesn't seem all that badly off, but I actually, truly believe all this noise-making is her trying to tell me she feels as bad as her poop looks. And whereas formerly she was fine with my picking her up, she seems resistant now because perhaps all that bare skin hurts? Maybe I'm anthropomorphizing.... anyway, I would value suggestions please. TY.
Oh, one more thing I know the treatment is dependent on what worms are present. But I'm thinking there may be more than the flatish white segments I saw undulating. That at least is present but perhaps there are other things. I have looked and haven't found anything though.
Thanks again.
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Which is dispiriting. Hoping for a magic bullet.
[elsewhere someone was talking about what toddlers these things are]. I set that aside and ferment it daily with, well, now with Modesto chick food that my brand new flock of five ate practically none of. Their mama just set them straight on BigGirl food. Shy of locking them up I wasn't sure how to manage that and they seems to be amply healthy. Also available is ScratchNPeck pellets for when the other runs out, it's just available and I top it off as needed. They don't take much of it. It's good to have around should I forget. Into the fermenting fines and baby-food I add a little bit of scratch and field peas to soak. The ten-beaks (5 are 2 months old) we have around here now eat more than a quart of this mash a day. Especially the babies; they are voracious. I chop up for them scrounged greens from the farmer's market - carrot tops mostly, but some onion leaves and spinach leaves and the rest. Squash blossoms, strawberries (which they do NOT like - ???) - stuff like that. The occasional ear of corn. Sometimes lettuce. They regularly get into the garden and consume all our kale; it's a wonder they are not stewing yet. Treats every few days are black sesame seeds which they adore like no other. And I give them - I am sure this will give some conniptions - freeze dried mealworms to up the protein level. I give a lot of these at bedtime. They go berserk for this too. I think they get enough. In the 4 or so years I've had them, I have bought one #25 of scratch. I know it's frowned on and they do get some of it soaked with the fines. And I do also sometimes throw out some animal-grade barley and wheat and rye; I don't think more than one handful each per week - less, really. Also I feed them back their eggshells, and they don't take it well. I literally have 3 kinds of calcium sitting around, none of which they much like or take. grump. Sometimes I hand-feed them calcium pills.
