Recessive genetics in Silkies

[Abcabc]

I am going to receive some hatching eggs (BBS) but the breeder told me her blacks when bred to her recessive white throw partridge, buff, white and black chicks, etc. I’m guessing her whites hide buff and partridge while her blacks are hiding one partridge and one recessive white. Correct?

Her birds are perfect in SOP otherwise and have won lots of ribbons but I want to avoid this issue.

How long would it take to breed the recessive partridge and white out from the BBS? Would it even be worth it?

Edit: And can blue and splash throw partridge or recessive white as well??

 

[JacinLarkwell]

@NatJ

 

[NatJ]

I’m guessing her whites hide buff and partridge while her blacks are hiding one partridge and one recessive white. Correct?

I would expect something like that, but I would not expect every black to have exactly one partridge gene and one recessive white gene. If she has been breeding black x black, then some chicks should be pure for not-partridge, and some should be pure for not-recessive white.

How long would it take to breed the recessive partridge and white out from the BBS? Would it even be worth it?

I do not know whether it would be worth breeding out the other traits or not.

Depending on how many of the blacks have those genes, you might be able to get rid of the genes in a single generation (use test-mating to see which birds carry those genes, cull the carriers, and that is the end of that.) But if that would leave you with no birds in the flock (or not enough), you might need to breed from birds that do have those genes, then use test-mating to choose which of the next generation to keep.

So getting rid of those genes could take anywhere from a single generation to two or three generations, depending on how many birds are affected, and how many times you have to stop and breed more in hopes of getting a few without. You may find that you can get rid of one gene quickly, and the other might take longer (if only a few birds carry the one, and many birds carry the other.)

To test mate: breed a black bird to a recessive white. Hatch a dozen or so eggs and see if you get any white or partridge chicks. If any chicks die shortly before hatching, open the egg and look at the chick color (easier and faster than setting more eggs, if something happens late in incubation.)

If you get any chicks that are recessive white, or that are partridge, or any other color than black, then you know the bird is carrying a gene you do not want.

If you get only black chicks, the bird you are testing is probably pure for not-recessive white. It might also be pure for partridge, depending on what genes the recessive white bird has (you might want to do an extra test-mating, to a partridge bird, just to be sure on this point. I'm not sure there.)

The chicks that you hatched as a test are not welcome in your black flock, because they are certain to carry genes you do not want (from their non-black parent.)

https://iqbirdtesting.com/
This company has a test for the recessive white gene in chickens, but the price looks rather high to me. I don't know if it would be cheaper to pay for tests when your black chicks hatch, or to raise them up and test-mate each one (that can add up to a lot of food, housing, and care, by the time you get your results.)

I do not know of a genetic test for partridge vs. black. I have no personal experience with the test for recessive white, so I cannot be positive that it is accurate. (I have had a few chickens tested for sex and for the blue egg gene by that company, and those results were accurate, verified by female going on to lay eggs, male going on to sire chicks, and blue egg later checked by egg colors of offspring.)

Edit: And can blue and splash throw partridge or recessive white as well??

Yes, if blacks are throwing partridge and recessive white, then blue and splash can throw those colors as well. The only difference is that some blue partridge and maybe splash partridge will show up as well (partridge + blue gene.)

You can test-mate blues and splashes the same way you would for blacks. The genetic test for recessive white will also work on them, just as well as it will on blacks.

 

[Abcabc]

I would expect something like that, but I would not expect every black to have exactly one partridge gene and one recessive white gene. If she has been breeding black x black, then some chicks should be pure for not-partridge, and some should be pure for not-recessive white.


I do not know whether it would be worth breeding out the other traits or not.

Depending on how many of the blacks have those genes, you might be able to get rid of the genes in a single generation (use test-mating to see which birds carry those genes, cull the carriers, and that is the end of that.) But if that would leave you with no birds in the flock (or not enough), you might need to breed from birds that do have those genes, then use test-mating to choose which of the next generation to keep.

So getting rid of those genes could take anywhere from a single generation to two or three generations, depending on how many birds are affected, and how many times you have to stop and breed more in hopes of getting a few without. You may find that you can get rid of one gene quickly, and the other might take longer (if only a few birds carry the one, and many birds carry the other.)

To test mate: breed a black bird to a recessive white. Hatch a dozen or so eggs and see if you get any white or partridge chicks. If any chicks die shortly before hatching, open the egg and look at the chick color (easier and faster than setting more eggs, if something happens late in incubation.)

If you get any chicks that are recessive white, or that are partridge, or any other color than black, then you know the bird is carrying a gene you do not want.

If you get only black chicks, the bird you are testing is probably pure for not-recessive white. It might also be pure for partridge, depending on what genes the recessive white bird has (you might want to do an extra test-mating, to a partridge bird, just to be sure on this point. I'm not sure there.)

The chicks that you hatched as a test are not welcome in your black flock, because they are certain to carry genes you do not want (from their non-black parent.)

https://iqbirdtesting.com/
This company has a test for the recessive white gene in chickens, but the price looks rather high to me. I don't know if it would be cheaper to pay for tests when your black chicks hatch, or to raise them up and test-mate each one (that can add up to a lot of food, housing, and care, by the time you get your results.)

I do not know of a genetic test for partridge vs. black. I have no personal experience with the test for recessive white, so I cannot be positive that it is accurate. (I have had a few chickens tested for sex and for the blue egg gene by that company, and those results were accurate, verified by female going on to lay eggs, male going on to sire chicks, and blue egg later checked by egg colors of offspring.)


Yes, if blacks are throwing partridge and recessive white, then blue and splash can throw those colors as well. The only difference is that some blue partridge and maybe splash partridge will show up as well (partridge + blue gene.)

You can test-mate blues and splashes the same way you would for blacks. The genetic test for recessive white will also work on them, just as well as it will on blacks.

Thank you! I love you! You got a big brain.

This sounds like a 2-3 year long project but I don’t mind. Only difficult part is the breeding and culling. Thankfully silkies are very popular in my area so any hens/pullets will get to live. Not so much the same for the males but…

I’m going to ask the breeder more about their splash pen. She is an old lady and didn’t know what recessive white meant so I didn’t want to bother her more than necessary since her birds are extremely beautiful with excellent type.

Thank you again!

 

[NatJ]

Thank you! I love you! You got a big brain.

This sounds like a 2-3 year long project but I don’t mind. Only difficult part is the breeding and culling. Thankfully silkies are very popular in my area so any hens/pullets will get to live. Not so much the same for the males but…

I’m going to ask the breeder more about their splash pen. She is an old lady and didn’t know what recessive white meant so I didn’t want to bother her more than necessary since her birds are extremely beautiful with excellent type.

Thank you again!

I'm glad it was helpful!

That sounds like a good project. Hopefully it will go well