Structural question regarding 2x4's

[Ironclay]

So maybe I'm overthinking things...

I have looked at lots of coop+run examples to see how people build their walls. I see many people are installing 2x4's with the wide face out, so they can install the wire on the inside-facing side of the board to hide seems. This is very aesthetic, and I like the look of this.

However, my every instinct is telling me this is wrong and that I should install 2x4's like the second photo, with the short face out. This is supposed to be more load-bearing.

My structure is 12 feet x 16 feet, with two internal bays (each 6x16). I want it to be able to have a roof with a low pitch that is suitable for hot climates. I do not get a lot of snow, but when I do, it promptly turns into inches of ice, which is actually much heavier and not easy to remove. My back wall will also need to be load-bearing as it'll be holding up vertical containers for strawberries. But most importantly, these walls need to be able to withstand torsion from winds, as I've been punched in the mouth by both hurricanes and tornados no less than 6 times in the last 2 years.


So, chicken-loving architectural gurus:

Are my instincts correct here? Should I absolutely avoid going the 'easy aesthetic' route? Or is this method actually more than adequate for this type of structure?

 

[DobieLover]

The aesthetic look can be used on non-load bearing walls.
Otherwise, have them full support the top plate width as shown in your second image.
If you want the rain to drain off well, you will want more than a low pitch. I would use at least a 5/12 pitch for decent drainage.
What you've drawn looks more like a run design than a coop design.
For a run, you can erect 4x4 posts and top them with beams to carry the loads and space them 8' apart, then add 2x4's flat side out to attach the HC to. That is how I built my run.

 

[Ironclay]

The aesthetic look can be used on non-load bearing walls.
Otherwise, have them full support the top plate width as shown in your second image.
If you want the rain to drain off well, you will want more than a low pitch. I would use at least a 5/12 pitch for decent drainage.
What you've drawn looks more like a run design than a coop design.
For a run, you can erect 4x4 posts and top them with beams to carry the loads and space them 8' apart, then add 2x4's flat side out to attach the HC to. That is how I built my run.
View attachment 3287790

Thank you for the pitch recommendation!

You are also correct that this is a segment of a run. I am trying to avoid vertical 4x4 posts, as this is a solo build and it is extremely hard for me to get a sharpshooter into my ground (post hole digger is out of the question, I've tried).

With wall segments, I can prefab what I need and walk it into place. Due to this restriction, I wanted to make sure I was making the best possible structural choices.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I'm a retired structural engineer. You want to overthink it? I can help.

The answer is obvious to me, go with the traditional method instead of the pretty one. There is a reason it is traditional. That was pretty much covered in a couple of weeks of my Mechanics of Materials class but I'm not going to try to go through that, especially with just words and not drawings.

If you were attaching wood it would be easier to see, but that wire strengthens the 2x4 in weight bearing. It gives what we call lateral support, if the 2x4 tries to bend that wire tightens and keeps it from bending so much. Try to fasten that wire mesh fairly tight so it doesn't sag much and firmly attach it to the 2x4. That will help the 2x4 to support load. Think of cutting a strip of cardboard from a cereal box maybe a half inch wide and five inches long. Stand that on end and mash on the top. It bends really easily. Then attach a string in the middle of that strip and tie it so the string keeps the middle from bending out of the way in the thin direction. It can support a lot more load. If you attach it so the support is along the narrow side instead of across it then it doesn't do any real good.

You get some benefit from that for a side load, like wind. But to see the benefit in a side wind, cut a strip of cardboard from a serial box maybe a half inch wide and five inches long. Then hold it by the ends and try to bend it in the thin direction. It bends without resistance. Then turn it 90 degrees and bend it across the wide side. A tremendous difference in bending strength.

The cardboard is an exaggeration to get the message across. To be honest you don't get much benefit from that wire mesh, other than it lets wind go through, but you get some benefit. Many people don't appreciate how much plywood sheathing in the walls or roof help the structural strength and keep it from racking. The biggest benefit you will get is the wind trying to bend those 2x4's along the 3-1/2" direction instead of the 1-1/2" direction. Since you are playing with hurricanes and tornadoes I'd suggest you do it that way.

 

[Ironclay]

I'm a retired structural engineer. You want to overthink it? I can help.

The answer is obvious to me, go with the traditional method instead of the pretty one. There is a reason it is traditional. That was pretty much covered in a couple of weeks of my Mechanics of Materials class but I'm not going to try to go through that, especially with just words and not drawings.

If you were attaching wood it would be easier to see, but that wire strengthens the 2x4 in weight bearing. It gives what we call lateral support, if the 2x4 tries to bend that wire tightens and keeps it from bending so much. Try to fasten that wire mesh fairly tight so it doesn't sag much and firmly attach it to the 2x4. That will help the 2x4 to support load. Think of cutting a strip of cardboard from a cereal box maybe a half inch wide and five inches long. Stand that on end and mash on the top. It bends really easily. Then attach a string in the middle of that strip and tie it so the string keeps the middle from bending out of the way in the thin direction. It can support a lot more load. If you attach it so the support is along the narrow side instead of across it then it doesn't do any real good.

You get some benefit from that for a side load, like wind. But to see the benefit in a side wind, cut a strip of cardboard from a serial box maybe a half inch wide and five inches long. Then hold it by the ends and try to bend it in the thin direction. It bends without resistance. Then turn it 90 degrees and bend it across the wide side. A tremendous difference in bending strength.

The cardboard is an exaggeration to get the message across. To be honest you don't get much benefit from that wire mesh, other than it lets wind go through, but you get some benefit. Many people don't appreciate how much plywood sheathing in the walls or roof help the structural strength and keep it from racking. The biggest benefit you will get is the wind trying to bend those 2x4's along the 3-1/2" direction instead of the 1-1/2" direction. Since you are playing with hurricanes and tornadoes I'd suggest you do it that way.

Thank you so much! I am definitely going with the "ugly" way, and will just dress it up with non-load-bearing trim.

 

[3KillerBs]

I can't speak to the structural thing, especially not with so much education behind it as has already been posted, but I'm suspecting that if hurricanes are an issue for you that you're in a hot climate.

This is my hot climate article, which includes some information on designing for airflow: https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/hot-climate-chicken-housing-and-care.77263/

And my ventilation article: https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/repecka-illustrates-coop-ventilation.77659/

Careful attention to airflow can help keep your roof on in high winds (also using hurricane ties on your beams and the appropriate fasteners for your roofing materials).

 

[perkolator]

The "aesthetic" orientation wouldn't even cross my mind for building this. If you have winds and hurricanes to deal with, definitely use the traditional orientation.

2x4 orientation aside, I'd probably be more concerned with anchoring it to the ground if you're saying your soil is too hard to penetrate for posts. I can just imagine wind getting underneath a 12x16 roof and ending up on the other side of your property like a bounce house/trampoline/umbrella/pop-up canopy

On my build I went traditional orientation and a very minimalist approach to the construction - but I hardly get any wind and have no concerns of roof loads other than leaves. With the 1.5" face, I didn't have any issues with attaching the HC and my seams are hidden. Here's an example of how I did the joining for the verticals, horizontals, rafters and roof purlins:
View media item 7948477

 

[Raptor Chicken]

You definitely want the 2x4's the standard way like in your second picture. Especially if it's supporting a roof.

If the winds are as bad as you say you might want to consider anchoring this structure to the ground and applying the appropriate Strong-Tie brackets to where the roof attaches to the walls.

 

[Eggcentric NanaJ]

So maybe I'm overthinking things...

I have looked at lots of coop+run examples to see how people build their walls. I see many people are installing 2x4's with the wide face out, so they can install the wire on the inside-facing side of the board to hide seems. This is very aesthetic, and I like the look of this.

However, my every instinct is telling me this is wrong and that I should install 2x4's like the second photo, with the short face out. This is supposed to be more load-bearing.

My structure is 12 feet x 16 feet, with two internal bays (each 6x16). I want it to be able to have a roof with a low pitch that is suitable for hot climates. I do not get a lot of snow, but when I do, it promptly turns into inches of ice, which is actually much heavier and not easy to remove. My back wall will also need to be load-bearing as it'll be holding up vertical containers for strawberries. But most importantly, these walls need to be able to withstand torsion from winds, as I've been punched in the mouth by both hurricanes and tornados no less than 6 times in the last 2 years.


So, chicken-loving architectural gurus:

Are my instincts correct here? Should I absolutely avoid going the 'easy aesthetic' route? Or is this method actually more than adequate for this type of structure?

I really like the 2" look as well but need the structural component too. When I get to the point of construction of the run, I am going to use a 1"x2" facia board on the outside over the hardware cloth. Only way I could have it both ways, strength and beauty.

 

[Ironclay]

I really like the 2" look as well but need the structural component too. When I get to the point of construction of the run, I am going to use a 1"x2" facia board on the outside over the hardware cloth. Only way I could have it both ways, strength and beauty.

That's where I've ended up. My last design features the load bearing set up but the wire is framed using 2x2's between the 2x4's. Ends up looking pretty nice, can bear weight, and wire should withstand abuse from any predators that I tend to get. Haven't built it yet because my septic system decided to fail and there went that tax refund I was saving for this, lol.