Need help with inner membrane trouble...

[GreenGoddess]

Ok... I have my lav orps hatching out today... The first one hatched without a problem... Two more were pipped and finally started zipping this afternoon... I noticed the second one was hatching our just fine but the one that pipped second wasn't moving, except for breathing... Of course, this is not my first hatch so i knew something was wrong... I watched it for a little bit and it still had made no progress... After the second chick hatched out, I looked at the last 3 eggs and none of them had pipped at all so I went ahead and got the chick that was in trouble out... I opened the bator just enough to get my hand in there, spritzed some water in there, grabbed the egg and closed it... Sure enough, the internal membrane had become "glue" and this poor thing was stuck... The funny thing is, the outter membrane was not dry so it's not really shrink wrapping... My temp is 100 and the humidity has been 65% except for when the first chick hatched of course... This isn't the first time this has happened so I would really love to know how to prevent it from happening in the future... Is it something I am doing/not doing or is it just one of those things that happens from time to time?

Goddess

 

[debilorrah]

I am gonna assume that the membrane was thick....

 

[GreenGoddess]

Sorry, was tired last night... I should have said the inner membrane and what was left of the albumen was like "glue"... Does that make more sense?

Goddess

 

[jvls1942]

there is only one (1) membrane in an egg.. that "inner" membrane is dried albumen..

for your next hatch try to stay at 99.5F 35% to 40% humidity and 60% at lockdown..

It is a mythe that 101F is the temperature for still air incubators.

 

[GreenGoddess]

Quote:
I have a still air hova bator that I put a fan in... (this has also happened in my homemade incubator and my brand new forced air hova bator though)... My temp is at 100 (I've had great temps and not so great temps when this has happened)... I don't think either of these would cause it since there are too many variables... The humidity pretty much stays the same each incubation (except one)... I don't add water until lockdown unless the humidity goes BELOW 30%... During lockdown, I keep the humidity about 60%-65%... The only time I didn't do a dry hatch is when I did staggered hatches and I kept the humidity at 50%-55% the entire time.... I can't remember if it happened during that hatch or not though... But almost every hatch I have to help at least one because of this... Last hatch I had problems because my 12 yr old turned the thermostat up and then opened it in the middle of hatching.. But this time, no one has been near the incubator but me... That's why I'm thinking it either has something to do with "dry hatching" or just one of those things that is either going to happen or not happen....

Goddess

 

[GreenGoddess]

Oh.... As for there only being two membranes, that part is correct... But the inner membrane is not the albumen... I've done enough eggtopsies... lol... There is the otter membrane that is like a white skin just under the shell and then there is another membrane that surrounds the chick... This membrane is clear and is what all the blood vessels run through... It's like an embryonic sac and is very thin... Inside that, you have the albumen, chick and yolk...

Just food for though...

(not literally of course!)

Goddess

 

[jenjscott]

Quote:
google anatomy of an egg, their are many images that include the inner membrane.

A mother hen has a body temp of about 106 (http://cal.vet.upenn.edu/projects/poultry/Syllabus/page37_44.htm)
When she sits on her eggs, the top of the egg is warmer than the bottom of the egg, frequent turning keeps it's internal temperature more even. In a still air incubator, there is a great difference between the temperature at the top and the bottom of the egg. So 99.5 might be fine if you are measuring the temperature on the floor of the incubator, but if measuring at the top of the egg, it should be 101.5, otherwise the bottom of the egg gets too cold. Some do try dropping the temperature a degree at hatch time. I do not know what the rationale is for this, but I do know that by hatch time the chicks are producing a lot more of their own heat and it is not as critical.

 

[jvls1942]

I never considered that "inner" membrane.. You make a good point.. I stand corrected..

I do not do eggtopsies.. my eyes are not that good..

 

[GreenGoddess]

Thanks Jenn... I was looking for a "non graphical" pic to show this... I saw the one you posted but then saw you posted it first... lol

Unfortunately, I've done eggtopsies on almost every egg I've lost as well as helped more than my share of chicks hatch... If the chick is still alive, I gently chip the shell and peel the "outter" membrane away and most times I can just slip the "inner" membrane over the chick... After the yolk is absorbed, I can either snip the membrane off or it will dry up and fall off in the incubator.. I've only done this when there was a human error (son opening bator)...

Well, 4th chick just hatched on it's own with no trouble at all.. I actually checked on it about an hour ago and it was just pipped.. The I checked it again and it was out! LOL... I'm still curious what would cause the albumen/inner membrane" to become sticky and gummy like that on one chick while all the rest hatch out just fine....

Goddess

 

[jenjscott]

ok, just total theory here, nothing to back it up, but some eggs are more porous than others, and could have dehydrated more in incubation than others, leaving what should be "lubrication" to turn into "glue".