Salmon Faverolles with Potential Bumblefoot (Pictures)

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

I have three Salmon Faverolles (named Brie, Mari, and Debbi) with what I think is bumble foot. None of the other breeds have this. They are 10 months old and in good health aside for the feet. I noticed it first about 1 month ago. We did a ton of research and tried to remove the bumblefoot from Brie first. She had it the worst. The surgery didn't go anything like all the videos and articles I had read. She started bleeding a lot everywhere when I did barely anything and we couldn't find a core. I ran over to my neighbor for help and we decided to just wrap her feet up and not go the surgery route. Ever since then I have been bringing Brie and Mari in for warm epsom salt soaks every three or so days. I remove the new scab, clean up the area, apply Prid or a Durvet Epsom Salt Poultice we bought, and wrap the feet up again with gauze and vet wrap. We decided not to do this to Debbi. She was doing best out of all them and we thought it a good test to compare an untreated foot to the treated feet. I looked today and they were way worse. I was shocked how much downhill they had gone. It had even spread to her toes. I have begun the process of treating her feet now as well.
Mari and Brie are doing slightly better. But it's not as much progress as I hoped. It's been taking a long time and a lot of work to treat their feet and I am discouraged at this slow progress.
Am I correct that this is bumblefoot or am I mistaken and treating for the wrong thing? They had the obvious black scab in the center of the foot. But whenever I have tried to look under the scab, I can't find a core to remove? I haven't seen anything they could cut themselves on -- all the roosting bars are smooth and sanded. It has been wet out lately though. Debbi had these long black scales on her footpad. When I removed the scab on the toe, it almost seemed like there was an air pocket beneath with a tiny amount of white liquid.
None of them are limping or seem in pain. They are such good girls and lay there peacefully and calmly as I spend about an hour on each chicken. Can anyone help?

-- Elspeth
Note: In most of the photos I have removed the scab. It doesn't look like that all the time.

 

[Tookie]

Its been a bit, so how are they?
I've had something similar in some of my birds and tried treating for bumble foot. Ended up not really being anything.
Mine had the scab looking things on one or both feet, nothing on the toes. A few had this. So I removed the scab on one of them but didn't find a core or anything that looked like it would be bumble foot. I stopped the treatment for bumble foot on the one and let her heal up, she was completely fine and had no limping. It was probably sores instead of bumble.
But their scabs weren't as large as the ones on your hens. If they aren't limping though and you can't find a infection maybe you should just let them heal up and see how they are.
Hopefully someone with more knowledge comes around!

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

Its been a bit, so how are they?
I've had something similar in some of my birds and tried treating for bumble foot. Ended up not really being anything.
Mine had the scab looking things on one or both feet, nothing on the toes. A few had this. So I removed the scab on one of them but didn't find a core or anything that looked like it would be bumble foot. I stopped the treatment for bumble foot on the one and let her heal up, she was completely fine and had no limping. It was probably sores instead of bumble.
But their scabs weren't as large as the ones on your hens. If they aren't limping though and you can't find a infection maybe you should just let them heal up and see how they are.
Hopefully someone with more knowledge comes around!

Thanks so much for checking up on them, Tookie!
They are doing about the same right now as they were a week ago. Thankfully they don't limp or show any signs of discomfort. I think Debbi's feet might be looking a little bit better (Granted, the lighting is a little different.)

That's interesting that you experienced something similar with your hens to what is going on with my hens! It hadn't occurred to me they might just be sores! I'll try to look into that.

I have started experimenting with different ointments and salves. My mom and sister made me beautiful labeled containers to hold them, my tools, and medicines.
I'm going to keep record of which ones help. I may come back and update this thread if we find something that helps (and if I have time).

Thank you for the information! I hope you have a good day!

 

[Tookie]

Thanks so much for checking up on them, Tookie!
They are doing about the same right now as they were a week ago. Thankfully they don't limp or show any signs of discomfort. I think Debbi's feet might be looking a little bit better (Granted, the lighting is a little different.)
View attachment 3839877

That's interesting that you experienced something similar with your hens to what is going on with my hens! It hadn't occurred to me they might just be sores! I'll try to look into that.

I have started experimenting with different ointments and salves. My mom and sister made me beautiful labeled containers to hold them, my tools, and medicines.
I'm going to keep record of which ones help. I may come back and update this thread if we find something that helps (and if I have time).

Thank you for the information! I hope you have a good day!

Glad to hear they're at least not worse off! I agree Debbi's feet are looking better.

This is a good opportunity to test different treatments! Hopefully you find something that works!
Feel free to update again.

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

~ Update ~
I think my little Brie had a horrible reaction to NU Stock on her foot!

Brie's feet have slowly been improving since I started treating her about a month ago. I was using Prid and Durvet Epsom Salt Poultice interchangeably. I have worked so hard to help her feet. It was moving along so slowly, but slightly improving. Four days ago, I decided to experiment and applied NU Stock to her right foot. I have multiple ointments that I wanted to try out and see if they helped any of their feet.

Today, I had to cut the bandage off her foot because it had swelled so much (And I tend to wrap on the looser side if possible cause I don't want to damage their feet. I always make sure the feet are wrapped properly and aren't too tight.) The swelling was visible on the top of her foot between her toes as well.

I just spent about an hour cleaning out pus and other gunk in her foot. It looked awful. It was red and warm to the touch. There was a lot of pus that came out. It didn't bleed much when I cleaned it out, which surprised me. I pulled a small, soft, white plug out. I don't know whether this was a firmer pus or a core? And there was a firm yellowy substance inside her foot. I think this was the first time I noticed a smell coming from that area.

I soaked her for 10 mins. in a warm epsom salt bath and added a little oregano oil this time (It wasn't added the prior time.) I gently cleaned out anything from the wound that I could. I rubbed her feet with Dawn to remove any NU Stock still remaining. I soaked her again for about 20 mins. and then cleaned more gunk out of her foot. I have wrapped her back up with the Epsom Salt Poultice since I know that hasn't caused any problems.

Does anyone know why this would have happened? I never would have expected a hen to have trouble with NU Stock on her foot. I didn't change her treatment at all aside for the ointment.

^ This was her foot before application of NU Stock. The scab was actually darker and bigger at this point.

____________________
The following photos are after the application of NU Stock. Her foot swelled probably two times the size it was before.

Spoiler: Open Wound & Pus

^ NU Stock is still in the wound.

^ You can see the swelling on the top of the foot between the toes.

^ This is a creamy pus that came out of the wound.
(Please excuse my dirty fingers. I was gardening all day.)

^ This is the white plug that came out. It was soft and lost it's shape when I squished it between a paper towel.

^ This is after cleaning. The swelling went down a little from the soaking.

I feel so bad for her. I've been working so hard to take care of her and this was a massive bummer for her to be set back this way.

 

[Tookie]

~ Update ~
I think my little Brie had a horrible reaction to NU Stock on her foot!

Brie's feet have slowly been improving since I started treating her about a month ago. I was using Prid and Durvet Epsom Salt Poultice interchangeably. I have worked so hard to help her feet. It was moving along so slowly, but slightly improving. Four days ago, I decided to experiment and applied NU Stock to her right foot. I have multiple ointments that I wanted to try out and see if they helped any of their feet.

Today, I had to cut the bandage off her foot because it had swelled so much (And I tend to wrap on the looser side if possible cause I don't want to damage their feet. I always make sure the feet are wrapped properly and aren't too tight.) The swelling was visible on the top of her foot between her toes as well.

I just spent about an hour cleaning out pus and other gunk in her foot. It looked awful. It was red and warm to the touch. There was a lot of pus that came out. It didn't bleed much when I cleaned it out, which surprised me. I pulled a small, soft, white plug out. I don't know whether this was a firmer pus or a core? And there was a firm yellowy substance inside her foot. I think this was the first time I noticed a smell coming from that area.

I soaked her for 10 mins. in a warm epsom salt bath and added a little oregano oil this time (It wasn't added the prior time.) I gently cleaned out anything from the wound that I could. I rubbed her feet with Dawn to remove any NU Stock still remaining. I soaked her again for about 20 mins. and then cleaned more gunk out of her foot. I have wrapped her back up with the Epsom Salt Poultice since I know that hasn't caused any problems.

Does anyone know why this would have happened? I never would have expected a hen to have trouble with NU Stock on her foot. I didn't change her treatment at all aside for the ointment.

View attachment 3841769
^ This was her foot before application of NU Stock. The scab was actually darker and bigger at this point.

____________________
The following photos are after the application of NU Stock. Her foot swelled probably two times the size it was before.

Spoiler: Open Wound & Pus

View attachment 3841774
^ NU Stock is still in the wound.
View attachment 3841775
^ You can see the swelling on the top of the foot between the toes.
View attachment 3841780
^ This is a creamy pus that came out of the wound.
(Please excuse my dirty fingers. I was gardening all day.)
View attachment 3841777
^ This is the white plug that came out. It was soft and lost it's shape when I squished it between a paper towel.
View attachment 3841778
^ This is after cleaning. The swelling went down a little from the soaking.

I feel so bad for her. I've been working so hard to take care of her and this was a massive bummer for her to be set back this way.

Poor girl! You were, and are, doing a great job! I have no idea if the Nu Stock made her worse her not, I would think it wouldn't but who knows. Looks like she does have bumble foot so do the treatment for that.

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

Poor girl! You were, and are, doing a great job! I have no idea if the Nu Stock made her worse her not, I would think it wouldn't but who knows. Looks like she does have bumble foot so do the treatment for that.

Thanks for helping with my birdies! It's so nice of you to keep coming back and checking on them! I will treat it like it is bumble foot.

I checked her foot on Friday and it looked like the swelling had gone down some. It's still pretty bad but at least it's better than it was! I'm gonna check it soon again.

 

[LaFleche]

Check their roosting bars or any ladder they like to perch on for splinters and stuck dirt.
Also make sure their roosts in the coop have no sharp edges and are not round but rather have the flat side up to alleviate the pressure on the underside of their feet.

Where Amrocks or Wyandotte feet are rather robust, Salmon Faverolles and French Marans have very delicate skin.

 

[Tookie]

Thanks for helping with my birdies! It's so nice of you to keep coming back and checking on them! I will treat it like it is bumble foot.

I checked her foot on Friday and it looked like the swelling had gone down some. It's still pretty bad but at least it's better than it was! I'm gonna check it soon again.

Of course, you're welcome!

That's great, good sign! At least it isn't worse.

 

[Elspeth Dinsmore]

Check their roosting bars or any ladder they like to perch on for splinters and stuck dirt.
Also make sure their roosts in the coop have no sharp edges and are not round but rather have the flat side up to alleviate the pressure on the underside of their feet.

Where Amrocks or Wyandotte feet are rather robust, Salmon Faverolles and French Marans have very delicate skin.

Thank you for taking the time to respond to me! I'm sorry it's taken me a while to get back! We are getting our garden planted for the year, so we have been busy.
I will make sure to check their roosting bars for the things you have mentioned.
I had checked a while back and they were smooth. But there definitely could have been something I missed.
I'll also give the bars a thorough cleaning tomorrow.