Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds

[FVRM]

Meyers sells blues. Is another selling just blacks?

It was blues? my mistake. I thought they were selling blacks

 

[DMRippy]

Please read the definition of EE. If it does not meet the standard it is an EE. White patches EE.... lack of beard and muffs EE..... and the list goes on and on....

http://www.ameraucana.org/faq.html#TWO

 

[maryhysong]

A must read for anyone planning to breed blues. It got my brain in gear! http://ameraucana.org/forum/index.php?topic=1733.0. .......stan

Thank you for the link~ that was a very interesting read. I guess just because a lot of people do it, I was under the impression that the normal breeding was b/b/s together. From reading that however I am now understanding that it should really be blue x blue and black x black. That will certainly help me make some different decisions than what I would have done otherwise.

 

[pathwandering]

I bought him/her from a local reputable person I found through the Vermont Bird Fancier's Club. The white is intentional, supposed to be mottled. That's why I was curious if it was the beard was not enough or if it was something else. I read the standard, but without having seen a lot of young birds to compare it to, it's hard to know.

 

[pips&peeps]

I don't think it is an issue. I have heard it is not mentioned in the SOP.

This is covered in the Standard of Perfection. You have to read the whole book, not just the ameraucana page. It is on page 32 of the current standard.

It is a point deduction for each white toenail.

You can breed black and blue together. Some people just want their blue birds based on silver to reduce that dirty red color the blue variety can get from sun damage. They also want their blacks based on gold/red for a better beetle green sheen. I have had no problems breeding the two colors together.

I find when you breed blue to blue you get all sorts of different shades of blues and I don't really care for that.

 

[pips&peeps]

I bought him/her from a local reputable person I found through the Vermont Bird Fancier's Club. The white is intentional, supposed to be mottled. That's why I was curious if it was the beard was not enough or if it was something else. I read the standard, but without having seen a lot of young birds to compare it to, it's hard to know.

The mottled color is a project variety and is not accepted by the APA. You won't do well at show with a mottled bird as the birds at this point still do not fit the mottled description in the standard.

 

[jajeanpierre]

I bought him/her from a local reputable person I found through the Vermont Bird Fancier's Club. The white is intentional, supposed to be mottled. That's why I was curious if it was the beard was not enough or if it was something else. I read the standard, but without having seen a lot of young birds to compare it to, it's hard to know.

The muffs are fine--I can't see the beard because of the angle in the pictures but I don't think you can get muffs without a beard. Hopefully someone with a better understanding of the development/inheritance of beards and muffs will chime in. Juveniles go through stages when the muffs and beard seem to come and goes.

When I first saw your bird, my first thought was it might be from mottled breeding. There are very few breeders working on that project color, I just dismissed it.

I have one mottled Cochin, so I know a little bit--albeit a very very tiny little bit--about the inheritance of mottled. To get a mottled bird with the white tips evenly distributed over the body, you need two genes for it. With one gene, you will get a bird that has a few white feathers, usually around the face. I think a bird carrying mottled can also be solid color with no white but I'm not positive. Do you know if the parents were both mottled? Your bird looks to have a lot of white around the face, so it might be carrying two mottled genes.

The white mottling increases with each successive molt. Most top quality mottled birds can only be shown for a short period of time because they end up with too much white. I'm not sure how much the amount of white changes on a bird carrying only one copy of the mottling gene. My own mottled Cochin was purchased as a 9-month old, so I didn't see the bird develop her color. I would think your bird should increase the amount of white-tipped feathers as it gets older.

There are a range of opinions about whether a project color is an EE or not. Some believe if the variety isn't recognized in the SOP, it is an Easter Egger. They have a valid point.

My own position is a little more fluid. Any unrecognized color is definitely an Easter Egger. For example, a wheaten crossed with a black will always be an Easter Egger, regardless of the parents being purebred Ameraucanas. The first few generations of a project color would also be Easter Eggers until the breeder can get that project color to look and breed like an Ameraucana.

I have a Lavender Ameraucana, not an Lavender Easter Egger. She was sold to me as an Ameraucana by a well respected breeder. When he found out I had a mottled Cochin, he recommended a breeder in Arkansas (Rose Knold) who was developing mottled Ameraucanas. He did not refer to them as Mottled Easter Eggers.

I just read a thought-provoking piece where the writer states that many varieties within a breed might not be genetically related to other varieties in their same breed in any way; that some varieties of breeds were taken from completely different parent stock (breeds) and then bred to the same shape.

I would love to see pictures of your bird as it develops, Pathwandering. I also am very curious to know the sex. I look at your bird and see cockerel, but another much more experienced person than me sees a pullet. Obviously I'm missing something. Being a bit of a sponge for knowledge, I would like to fill in those missing gaps.

 

[tigercreek]

Thank you for the link~ that was a very interesting read. I guess just because a lot of people do it, I was under the impression that the normal breeding was b/b/s together. From reading that however I am now understanding that it should really be blue x blue and black x black. That will certainly help me make some different decisions than what I would have done otherwise.

I wouldn't take this as gospel, but I see the point. When you breed splash to splash, you begin to get washed out color. Same genes involved with blue, so that may also be the case with them. I am going to try this, if I ever get a blue with decent lacing. There are so many other genes involved that I just don't know what will happen. I do believe that it is worth the effort. It certainly hasn't seemed to hurt the Andalusians... As Jean said, I did get a bunch of different shades when breeding blue rocks. I believe that was due to other genes in the mix that can be bred out with color selective breeding. Just don't loose type to do it.....

 

[jajeanpierre]

This is covered in the Standard of Perfection. You have to read the whole book, not just the ameraucana page. It is on page 32 of the current standard.

It is a point deduction for each white toenail.

You can breed black and blue together. Some people just want their blue birds based on silver to reduce that dirty red color the blue variety can get from sun damage. They also want their blacks based on gold/red for a better beetle green sheen. I have had no problems breeding the two colors together.

I find when you breed blue to blue you get all sorts of different shades of blues and I don't really care for that.

I HATE trying to find anything in the SOP. It is the most stupidly arranged reference book I've ever tried to read. It is so bad, I even wrote APA to volunteer to help proofread the next edition. As I expected from an organization that could put out such a mess of a book, they never responded to my offer.

I just spent a good three quarters of an hour trying to find what the penalty would be for white feathers in the a black variety. I couldn't find it. I'm sure it is there somewhere. Perhaps if I read the first 40 pages in order and then read it again and again, I might have a better understanding of their book. I try to use it by looking up a section, such as "Cutting for defects" but I find it just such a hodge podge to be almost useless.

Pips&Peeps, I read your reference to the deduction for a white toe nail, but it only talks about a white toe nail on a black-legged variety. I thought most varieties of Ameraucanas were slate. I'm sure it is a deduction somewhere, but I just can't find it. I hate that book.

 

[MrsBachbach]

No, it's an easter egger - has yellow skin.

Ok. I'm going to have to ask. How can you tell it has yellow skin? The legs appear slate to my eyes. Even with my glasses. Could be the lighting in my room making it appear so.