Black crested White Polish

[I Like Turkeys]

I would pick nicalandia's brain if i where you. Just to see if you have the columbia restriction or not.

I'll do that.

 

[RoostersAreAwesome]

Here's some really useful info:

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=pfbid02KSEPtA4F8dYXMYTu2akjRsgqr89EGJWdu8SdsoMrx8vLWQ9fWKvnxFx67Pf19bm9l&id=100062982831214

Gives a bit of the story on how the originals were created. As I suspected silver laced is in there. And Lakenvelder. I would think an acceptable backcross would be to any silver laced (non bearded)) you could find with poor lacing and more dark in the crests. Indeed from your pictures it sure looks like the Ideal stock has silver laced in the parentage. Good luck on your adventures.

Good find. It makes sense silver laced and lakenvelders were used; sounds like a perfect match, even if it’d take a few generations for proper coloring.
I agree that a proper backcross would probably need to be a silver laced; but I’ve never actually seen a non-bearded silver laced- not that they don’t exist, mind you, just that I’ve never seen them advertised anywhere- and a general concern i‘d have about a silver polish with less than ideal markings is they’d also have poor body type. That‘ll be something to have to really search for.
Whenever I look at my own birds, I somewhat see them as looking more spangled. I’m not entirely familiar with that pattern, but a lot of my birds have heavy breast markings, hackle markings, and a few have their tail feathers tipped in black. Not that this is good, or I’m confident in my own analysis, just a note on what I see. View attachment 3556605View attachment 3556596View attachment 3556597

Those forward-facing crests definitely hint at spitzhauben blood

 

[NagemTX]

Those forward-facing crests definitely hint at spitzhauben blood

I agree with that. Also my Spitzhauben that makes me think they used polish some where down the line.

 

[NagemTX]

I wonder if they used them because the base of a silver spangled Spitzhauben is or seams to always be black in color?

 

[Drewsroo]

I'll do that.

Great now you have me researching spangling and it seems to be a mish mash of genes and now I am lying down with a cold rag over my head.

Would columbian restrictor cover it up?

Agree you need a genetics guru on here.

 

[NagemTX]

Its not that bad. Or is it!

Lol The second post in this thread!

Quote from that thread. From Wappoke.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...pe-to-spangle-a-chicken.1132287/post-17533625

 

[Drewsroo]

Its not that bad. Or is it!

Lol The second post in this thread!

Yes. Yes it is. that's the thread I went to and saw genetic breakdown for spangling and died a little on the inside.

 

[NagemTX]

In a nutshell Spangling is linked to Columbian and why they would use Spitzhauben in the mix.

 

[NatJ]

Great now you have me researching spangling and it seems to be a mish mash of genes and now I am lying down with a cold rag over my head.

Two basic points:

--the term "spangling" is used for two different color patterns, with very different genetics. the kind of spangling in Spitzhaubens and Hamburgs is different than the kind of spangling found in "Spangled Russian Orloffs" and "Spangled Old English Game Bantams" and "Spangled Cornish Bantams."

--For the Spitzhauben-type spangling, it not really any more complicated than lacing. Each of them requires a specific combination of genes (similar to each other but not quite identical), plus probably some other genes to make it look just right instead of messy. The horizontal pencilling found in Campines and Hamburgs is also genetically similar. All three of those patterns use the pattern gene (that organizes the black on the feathers into one pattern or another), plus particular combinations of other genes that control which pattern it is.

 

[I Like Turkeys]

Those forward-facing crests definitely hint at spitzhauben blood

I agree entirely. The shorter, taller crests made me suspect they were mixed when i first got them, and the coloring has always suggested such an ancestry.

Great now you have me researching spangling and it seems to be a mish mash of genes and now I am lying down with a cold rag over my head.

Would columbian restrictor cover it up?

Agree you need a genetics guru on here.

I believe, but correct me if I’m wrong, that columbia just turns spangling into lacing, granted all the necessary genes are in homozygous form.
@NatJ I am speaking about spitzhauben spangling, which I didn’t clarify at all, but every time I’ve referenced it I’ve been meaning the type in spitzhaubens.