Extreme shift in flock dynamics

[Auntiejessi3]

First a bit about my flock, 2-2 1/2yr old hens Light Brahma (queen B) WTB (#2 in the pecking order), 2-1yr 9mo hens Welsummer, OE, 2-10mo pullets Favaucana, BLRW, 2-7mo pullets English Orps, 1-7mo Cockerel English Orp. Note: All 3 of the Orps came to me at 13 weeks old and integrated into the flock with ease.

Last week on Thursday after work I went out to collect eggs and check on everyone like I do every day, my WTB was in the coop talking up a storm, a bit unusual for her since she is always hanging out with Maribel (queen B), but I didn't think much of it at the time. I went to put the eggs inside then grabbed my waterer to refill one of their waters and when I walked back over there one of the 7mo orps was chasing her around the run and chicken yard, pulling her feathers every chance she got, until Maribel stepped in and put a stop to it. Since then, she has been in the coop every day. She'll will run out grab some food and water and run back in. Everyone else is acting completely normal, when I give them wet mash everyone eats according to their place in the pecking order, but Betty will not participate in anything, and if she does come out, she runs straight to Maribel who has to run interference to keep Deliliah away from her. What is going on?

 

[EggSighted4Life]

Everyone else is acting completely normal, when I give them wet mash everyone eats according to their place in the pecking order, but Betty will not participate in anything, and if she does come out, she runs straight to Maribel who has to run interference to keep Deliliah away from her. What is going on?

I worked out some of that but couldn't figure out where Betty comes in and what her age is (unless aka WTB).. entering winter molt is my first guess??

Orps are pushy birds in the flock.. their so called friendliness folks talk about is towards people, and ultimately a side effect of confidence, IMO. So perhaps it's somehow related.. just to get the conversation started.

Sounds like the Orp sensed a weakness in the force (like possible molt) and is going for it.

Flock pecking order can be very dynamic.. with up and coming, newly maturing and spry juveniles verses elders who might start feeling their age.. then add in the whole breed trait differences and I'd be surprised not to see some changes. Aside from specific friendships the chickens have formed with one another.. they're always looking to elevate their place in the pecking order.. and will do that at the expense of another bird..

If you're cockerel hasn't yet established his dominance on the head hen.. if she doesn't accept it, they too will fight.. In other words there may be more changes coming yet.

 

[Auntiejessi3]

but couldn't figure out where Betty comes in and what her age is (unless aka WTB)..

Yes Betty is #2 in the pecking order and the WTB.

entering winter molt is my first guess??

Everyone already molted, so I don't think it's that

If you're cockerel hasn't yet established his dominance on the head hen

He hasn't, he has started mating with 1 of the orps (not the one with the attitude) but the other ladies still put him in his place.
I appreciate your insight! Betty is one of our first along with Maribel and they have a permanent place to live till their last breath.

 

[Matejka]

Thoroughly look Betty over, injuries, mites, vent everywhere and everything. Chickens can sense weakness, she may have an injury you haven't seen, or be getting sick, eggbound or ascites or respiratory, that's not serious enough for you to notice, but her flockmates have noticed. Maybe pull the aggressor for a week, then reintroduce, thereby changing pecking order, hopefully putting aggressor lower in order.

 

[SourRoses]

Orps are pushy birds in the flock.. their so called friendliness folks talk about is towards people, and ultimately a side effect of confidence, IMO. So perhaps it's somehow related.. just to get the conversation started.

That's not what I'm talking about when I'm one of the ones praising Orp friendliness.
I don't make pets out of chickens and I prefer roosters keep their distance. So as much as we love our big English Orpington I wouldn't say he is sweet with people. He is not remotely aggressive.
But with his flock mates? That's where his sweetness shines. As an older chick he played Momma to smaller ones, letting them snuggle under his feathers. Even as they matured he allowed other cockerels to come to him for warmth. At nearly twice their size he just stared down challengers rather than peck or attack them. I removed those boys in the order they gave him problems so that he wouldn't lose confidence or suffer injury.

When he started breeding there was none of the normal cockerel aggression with the hens. He only bred the hens that were laying and squatting. I now put most all of the young pullets and extra layers in with him because I know he will treat them well.
That's what I, personally, mean by sweet.

That said, every chicken is an individual. A breed that trends docile is still going to have some that are not, and vice versa.


OP, it really sounds to me like mating kerfuffles. Hens often hide from insistent cockerels indoors just the way you described. As well, the pulling of neck feathers is one way clumsy, ignorant, randy cockerels try to catch unwilling hens.
You said it was "one of" the Orps being the aggressor. Did you see if it was the cockerel? If it was one of the pullets, are you sure they are females?
I have noticed with Orps that the under cockerels have significantly retarded combs/wattles, but that could be because the dominant roos have so much head gear that the difference really stands out.

 

[Auntiejessi3]

Thoroughly look Betty over, injuries, mites, vent everywhere and everything. Chickens can sense weakness, she may have an injury you haven't seen, or be getting sick, eggbound or ascites or respiratory, that's not serious enough for you to notice, but her flockmates have noticed. Maybe pull the aggressor for a week, then reintroduce, thereby changing pecking order, hopefully putting aggressor lower in order.

I did that this weekend, she's as healthy as can be as far as I can tell. Everyone was wormed in October and I just gave everyone a spray down with elector psp about 2 weeks ago. No swelling in the abdomen, crop is functioning like it should, vent is clean and she currently isn't laying (she's on break)

 

[3KillerBs]

Sounds like the Orp sensed a weakness in the force (like possible molt) and is going for it.

Or just thinks that she ought to be higher up and is seeing what she can achieve.

Flock pecking order can be very dynamic.. with up and coming, newly maturing and spry juveniles verses elders who might start feeling their age.. then add in the whole breed trait differences and I'd be surprised not to see some changes.

I don't even try to keep track of it. If there's no blood and no one is being denied food and water then it's their problem, not mine.

If you're cockerel hasn't yet established his dominance on the head hen.. if she doesn't accept it, they too will fight.. In other words there may be more changes coming yet.

Indeed.

Hens' status as his favorites will change their place in the pecking order.

she currently isn't laying (she's in break)

If the young one IS laying then this could be it -- it's natural for actively-laying birds to rank higher than non-layers so she may be trying to claim this status.

 

[Auntiejessi3]

That's not what I'm talking about when I'm one of the ones praising Orp friendliness.
I don't make pets out of chickens and I prefer roosters keep their distance. So as much as we love our big English Orpington I wouldn't say he is sweet with people. He is not remotely aggressive.
But with his flock mates? That's where his sweetness shines. As an older chick he played Momma to smaller ones, letting them snuggle under his feathers. Even as they matured he allowed other cockerels to come to him for warmth. At nearly twice their size he just stared down challengers rather than peck or attack them. I removed those boys in the order they gave him problems so that he wouldn't lose confidence or suffer injury.

When he started breeding there was none of the normal cockerel aggression with the hens. He only bred the hens that were laying and squatting. I now put most all of the young pullets and extra layers in with him because I know he will treat them well.
That's what I, personally, mean by sweet.

That said, every chicken is an individual. A breed that trends docile is still going to have some that are not, and vice versa.


OP, it really sounds to me like mating kerfuffles. Hens often hide from insistent cockerels indoors just the way you described. As well, the pulling of neck feathers is one way clumsy, ignorant, randy cockerels try to catch unwilling hens.
You said it was "one of" the Orps being the aggressor. Did you see if it was the cockerel? If it was one of the pullets, are you sure they are females?
I have noticed with Orps that the under cockerels have significantly retarded combs/wattles, but that could be because the dominant roos have so much head gear that the difference really stands out.

He keeps his distance and is mannered from everything I've seen. It was one of the pullets (I'm positive about their sex) that was doing the chasing and feather pulling... the offender below

 

[Auntiejessi3]

If the young one IS laying

She is, she started a few weeks back, laid 2 eggs then quit, just started back up yesterday.

being denied food and water

I'm afraid she isn't getting near what she needs, but I'm letting it play out since there has been no blood shed. I did give her a small handful of food today when I made everyone their wet mash

 

[3KillerBs]

She is, she started a few weeks back, laid 2 eggs then quit, just started back up yesterday.

I'm afraid she isn't getting near what she needs, but I'm letting it play out since there has been no blood shed. I did give her a small handful of food today when I made everyone their wet mash

Do you have multiple feed and water stations, preferable set up so that a bird at one station can't see the birds at the other?