I have ANOTHER androgenous chicken😅

[Allsfairinloveandbugs]

This looks like it's going to be a fun ride. Now I have even more excitement to hurry up and get to spring.

All of the hens in my present flock are seasoned layers, no pullets, and a few are already exhibiting sexual behavior even though the days only just began to lengthen. Egg production was down to an egg or two per week just a few weeks ago, and I'm back up to five in one day again already. So you may not have to wait until it's officially spring to see if Sonnet is going to produce an egg.

Are you handling Sonnet a lot? I find that the more I handle a hen, the more she responds with sexual behavior, squatting to be specific, when I touch her. Also, check those pelvic bones regularly to judge if they are stationary as a cockerel's would be or if they are moving farther apart as pullets do as they approach point of lay.

Pop the corn people!

I haven't handled Sonnet lately, but she's around roosters and cockerels daily, and they haven't paid any sexual attention to her, nor has she submitted to them. But her comb only began reddening up a couple weeks ago, so it may still be too early yet. Some of my 2023-hatched EE pullets surprised me by beginning to lay in November, and since Sonnet is now 6 months old, i don't expect she will wait much longer if she is gonna lay. Also, the roosters and cockerels should begin mating with her soon if she is getting close to laying. But great idea on checking the pelvic bones, I will begin doing that to see if there are any changes. I was regularly handling her several weeks ago and she didn't seem to mind, seemed to quickly learn to enjoy my attention actually. I can't quite shake the thoughts of how similiar she appears to Big Girl at this age, but also don't discount the fact that everyone here so far thinks "pullet." I will post a picture of Sonnet's egg as soon as and if she lays one!

 

[JedJackson]

Very interesting you don't think those are sickle feathers. (Not disagreeing; it just never crossed my mind that maybe they weren't.) She's the largest EE hen/pullet I've ever had hatch, and I've had well over 200 hens, but also had by far the largest EE cockerel I've ever had hatch in 2023 too, so maybe just have a rooster throwing bigger birds. (Most all of my EEs have always been on the smaller side of average. ) I read on another BYC thread where someone said that a darker blue wash of feathers on the head, neck and back on a blue or splash bird signify cockerel coloring, but I couldn't find any verification that backed that statement up. Do you know if that is true or false?

Blue and splash cockerels often get deeper colored shoulder patches, which will later develop into glossy male specific feathers, along with the skinny pointed feathers sweeping down the sides of the saddle. I just don't see that here. Some of the feathers are narrower, but they all have rounded edges.

The bird looks splash with gold leakage and a few solid black feathers mixed in, but those colors aren't confined to shoulder patches. I still think it's a female with cool color genetics.

 

[chrissynemetz]

I think it's a pullet.

 

[Perris]

this may or may not help you @Allsfairinloveandbugs
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...a-chicken-has-its-own-male-or-female-identity
(someone else linked to this on another thread a little while ago, but I can't remember who or where, so if they read this, thanks again for the link and please remind me who you are!)

 

[azygous]

this may or may not help you @Allsfairinloveandbugs
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/...a-chicken-has-its-own-male-or-female-identity
(someone else linked to this on another thread a little while ago, but I can't remember who or where, so if they read this, thanks again for the link and please remind me who you are!)

@Perris could you give us a short synopsis of the article? I'm adverse to registering my email address on web sites as it propagates a slew of spam.

 

[Perris]

@Perris could you give us a short synopsis of the article? I'm adverse to registering my email address on web sites as it propagates a slew of spam.

Here's the abstract from Nature, which was the principal publication of the research

Abstract​

In the mammalian model of sex determination, embryos are considered to be sexually indifferent until the transient action of a sex-determining gene initiates gonadal differentiation. Although this model is thought to apply to all vertebrates, this has yet to be established. Here we have examined three lateral gynandromorph chickens (a rare, naturally occurring phenomenon in which one side of the animal appears male and the other female) to investigate the sex-determining mechanism in birds. These studies demonstrated that gynandromorph birds are genuine male:female chimaeras, and indicated that male and female avian somatic cells may have an inherent sex identity. To test this hypothesis, we transplanted presumptive mesoderm between embryos of reciprocal sexes to generate embryos containing male:female chimaeric gonads. In contrast to the outcome for mammalian mixed-sex chimaeras, in chicken mixed-sex chimaeras the donor cells were excluded from the functional structures of the host gonad. In an example where female tissue was transplanted into a male host, donor cells contributing to the developing testis retained a female identity and expressed a marker of female function. Our study demonstrates that avian somatic cells possess an inherent sex identity and that, in birds, sexual differentiation is substantively cell autonomous.

https://www.nature.com/articles/nature08852#citeas

And the NG piece, in more ordinary language, practically begins and ends with the comments "every single cell in a chicken’s body is either male or female. Each one has its own sexual identity. It seems that becoming male or female is a very different process for birds than it is for mammals... The fact that something as seemingly straightforward as being male or female could be so complicated in an animal as familiar as a chicken tells us just how much wonder there is left to uncover in the natural world."

 

[Perris]

and a gynandromorph bird looks like this (from the NG piece; this is a real chicken)

 

[Shabby Chic-Hens]

I think it’s a pullet. She seems to be female.

 

[JacinLarkwell]

I read on another BYC thread where someone said that a darker blue wash of feathers on the head, neck and back on a blue or splash bird signify cockerel coloring, but I couldn't find any verification that backed that statement up. Do you know if that is true or false?

I have had a few females that have darker heads amd necks. I think that's just how blue should act

 

[RaesChicks]

Before I post photos and information regarding my current androgynous chicken, here is a link to the previous thread that this thread title refers to.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/i-have-an-androgynous-chicken.1504007/

This newest androgynous chicken is now 25 weeks old. It is a broody-hatched Easter Egger, one of a clutch of 8 with a hatch date of July 13, 2023. The clutch all hatched from extra-large blue eggs, similiar in size, give or take a few grams. All hens that laid the blue eggs were three years old. The chick in question was noticeably larger at hatch than the other chicks. The questionable chick appears to be white/yellow in the photo below, but feathered out to be splash blue.
View attachment 3718851

By the time the chicks turned 6 weeks old, it seemed obvious by comb sizes and colors as well as feather color patterns that there were 4 pullets and 4 cockerels. Here is the splash chick at age 7 weeks. Despite her still comparatively larger size, there were no thoughts in my mind that she was anything other than a cute pullet.
View attachment 3718833
View attachment 3719824

For the next several weeks I didn't take any more photos of the clutch. However, I did note that the splash chick continued to grow larger than the other pullets as well as all but one of the cockerels. But since her small, light pink comb appeared to be that of a pullet and she had no male saddle feathers, I didn't ponder the size difference.

Due to plentiful six-feet-plus rat snakes residing on my rural wooded property, I didn't let the group out of their hardware cloth-protected chick pen until snake season had passed. When I finally did, and clearly saw the posture and stance of the splash chick, my immediate thoughts were "Oh, wow, hmmm." Not only was "she" much taller than her pullet hatchmates, she also walked and stood very upright. But in contrast, her pea comb was still small and pink, she had no long male saddle feathers, and her legs were very thin and petite with no signs of spur bumps. Now I was confused.

Age 16 weeks
View attachment 3719027
View attachment 3719989

If you think the two photos above appear to depict a pullet, just wait for the next one!
Age 16 weeks
View attachment 3718861
Is it even possible for a pullet to have such an upright posture and stance?! After viewing this picture, I felt sheepishly foolish to have thought there was any "her" here, especially since some (but not all) of the saddle feathers were pointed at the ends. (close-up pics of saddle feathers to follow) But even the pointed ones were curiously wider and shorter than is typical for a cockerel this age. Before you make your judgement call, please see the following photos and video during the ensuing ten week's time up to the current date.

Age 16 weeks
When she lowered her head, she still appeared to be (mostly?) a pullet.
View attachment 3719033

Age 17 weeks
At age 17 weeks, the saddle feathers were neither long, thin and pointed like the cockerels, nor short and rounded like the pullets. Instead they were all fairly short, but some (not all) had pointed tips.
View attachment 3720003

Age nineteen weeks
No further obvious changes in appearance, and no cockerel behaviors such as crowing, attempting to mate with POL pullets or older hens, etc. The first two photos below include another view of her still unchanged saddle feathers. In the third photo, the Wyandotte standing in front is exactly 1 week younger. By now I was spending considerable time observing and photographing my unusual chicken, and realized she needed a name. I chose the name "Sonnet" because it means "little song" in Italian, and her interesting appearance was helping my heart to "sing" again after losing several favorite older hens the past year. In addition, I was beginning to think "same song, second verse" in relation to my first androgenous chicken.
View attachment 3719125
View attachment 3718849
View attachment 3718831

Age 23 weeks
Until now, there had been no detectable changes in feather appearance or behaviors for the past two months. However, at age 23 weeks, a sickle feather began to grow. Also, her comb began to redden, though it didn't increase in size.
View attachment 3718826

Age 25 weeks
Sonnet now has two obvious sickle feathers, and her comb has reddened more. But comb size hasn't changed, her legs are still thin with no spur buds, and her saddle feathers haven't changed. Still no cockerel (or pullet) mating behaviors whatsoever.
View attachment 3720078
View attachment 3720027
View attachment 3720061
View attachment 3720059
View attachment 3720030
View attachment 3720077

If it is true that a picture speaks a thousand words, it may also be true that a video speaks a thousand pictures. Here is a video I took of Sonnet at age 25 weeks.
It shows her/his/their very erect and upright posture. All the other pullets in the video also hatched during summer 2023.

I am very interested to know the thoughts and opinions of BYC members! If you notice any attributes and characteristics I didn't mention, please point them out. I didn't feel certain my first androgenous chicken was a "they" until Big Girl turned two+ years old. By then she had never laid an egg, never mated nor been mated, and exhibited life-long behaviors of a gentle hen, even though her appearance became more masculine as time passed. (For one thing she grew enormous spurs.) Sonnet is still too young to be sure about her sex(s), but she does bear uncanny similiarities to Big Girl. I realize a duel-sexed bird is rare, and never in my wildest dreams ever expected to possibly have another. I expect Sonnet's appearance to change in the coming weeks/months/years, though in what way(s) I cannot foresee. I will update if i see any further changes, and will update in a couple month's time either way. Tell me what you see and think!

I had nearly the same experience with my Easter eggers. I have one that is much larger, stands just the same, pea comb stayed small and pink after the others turned red, struts around, stands upright, always stands away from the flock on lookout. To this day I’m not convinced Fluffy is fully a “she” even though my son swears he caught her laying. She has the same tail feathers and everything. Alas, I think both of our chickens are hens. They are very close in age as well. I think you will find that she begins laying soon enough.