Is this a normal looking saddle/back feather for an IB Peacock?

[PeepsCA]

See the White speckles? There's a few of these in the center of the lower area of my adult IB Peacock's saddle, right above the area where the first small/short train feathers with eyes start to grow from (this is just the tip of the feather).

He's supposedly carrying at least 1 Pied gene and 1 White Eye gene but is completely hiding any and all White on the rest of his body. He's coming up on turning 5 sometime late this season and I have had him since late 2011, but he has never had any White Eyes in his train, no White flights or coverts and no throat patch. I really had to dig thru this saddle feathers to find a few of these speckled feathers.

Are these White speckles possibly a small expression of the Pied gene or the White Eye gene? or just a tiny bit of normal barring? The speckles are definitely White, not tan or beige like the barring on his shoulders and wings.

Also, the young Peacock in my avatar is his son, and has a few pure White feathers growing right in the center of his train... coincidence?

 

[DylansMom]

See the White speckles? There's a few of these in the center of the lower area of my adult IB Peacock's saddle, right above the area where the first small/short train feathers with eyes start to grow from (this is just the tip of the feather).

He's supposedly carrying at least 1 Pied gene and 1 White Eye gene but is completely hiding any and all White on the rest of his body. He's coming up on turning 5 sometime late this season and I have had him since late 2011, but he has never had any White Eyes in his train, no White flights or coverts and no throat patch. I really had to dig thru this saddle feathers to find a few of these speckled feathers.

Are these White speckles possibly a small expression of the Pied gene or the White Eye gene? or just a tiny bit of normal barring? The speckles are definitely White, not tan or beige like the barring on his shoulders and wings.

Also, the young Peacock in my avatar is his son, and has a few pure White feathers growing right in the center of his train... coincidence?

I'm pretty sure that is just normal barring, all of my barred wing males have shell feathers like that even the ones who I do not believe are carrying any white, pied or WE genes.

 

[zazouse]

The only way to know for sure is breed him with a white hen and see what you get.
My dark pieds have white splotches under their tail and on the tan area of their legs, some have molten colored feet and all have the white patch on thir throats.

Some of my pieds are out of parents that expressed no white at all ,
like this fella.Pie

 

[PeepsCA]

The only way to know for sure is breed him with a white hen and see what you get.

If I had a nickle for every time someone has told me that I need to breed him to a White... I'd be able to afford to order a White Peahen (preferably one out of a pair for Silver Pieds) from one of the major Peafowl breeders, lol.
I'd rather breed my Paint mares this summer vs buying a shipped White PeaHen tho. Priorities ya know, lol.

Guess I'm just grasping at straws, looking for ANY sign of White on this bird since the breeder I got him from lost the breeding records for him in a PC crash. This is the first adult Peacock I've ever had my hands on, so I have zero experience with what normal feathers look like or don't look like.

 

[AugeredIn]

A bird that is split pied will not normally show any white. A dark pied will. It would be very unusual for a bird to be split white eye and have never had any visibly flecked feathers AND a few white eyes. Lets see a picture of the entire bird.

 

[zazouse]

If I had a nickle for every time someone has told me that I need to breed him to a White... I'd be able to afford to order a White Peahen (preferably one out of a pair for Silver Pieds) from one of the major Peafowl breeders, lol.
I'd rather breed my Paint mares this summer vs buying a shipped White PeaHen tho. Priorities ya know, lol.

Guess I'm just grasping at straws, looking for ANY sign of White on this bird since the breeder I got him from lost the breeding records for him in a PC crash. This is the first adult Peacock I've ever had my hands on, so I have zero experience with what normal feathers look like or don't look like.

It was the only answer i had for you sorry

 

[zazouse]

A bird that is split pied will not normally show any white. A dark pied will. It would be very unusual for a bird to be split white eye and have never had any visibly flecked feathers AND a few white eyes. Lets see a picture of the entire bird.

Are you talking to me?

 

[DylansMom]

If I had a nickle for every time someone has told me that I need to breed him to a White... I'd be able to afford to order a White Peahen (preferably one out of a pair for Silver Pieds) from one of the major Peafowl breeders, lol.
I'd rather breed my Paint mares this summer vs buying a shipped White PeaHen tho. Priorities ya know, lol.

Guess I'm just grasping at straws, looking for ANY sign of White on this bird since the breeder I got him from lost the breeding records for him in a PC crash. This is the first adult Peacock I've ever had my hands on, so I have zero experience with what normal feathers look like or don't look like.

I've been selling my feathers for 10 years now, it's how I pay for my little Pea addiction problem.

Here is one that shows the barring a bit more obviously, but I went thru my shell feathers and in 30 seconds I found 10 that looked just like yours. The pieds or splits will have the white show up on the brightly colored part of the feathers not just down around the bottom where the down starts.

 

[PeepsCA]

A bird that is split pied will not normally show any white. A dark pied will. It would be very unusual for a bird to be split white eye and have never had any visibly flecked feathers AND a few white eyes. Lets see a picture of the entire bird.

Well he must be very unusual then

The last convo I had with the breeder I got him from basically went something like "he could be out of this pen, but could have been out of that pen" and then the convo went 50 different other directions, lol. The mother could have (most likely) been a Pied with a single copy of W/E and the father may have had some White flights... but none of this is definite and there were other possibilities but I cannot remember what was said. My bad. I emailed the breeder asking him to email the info and have not heard back from him.

None of my 3 Hens he's breeding (they all have unknown backgrounds as well) have any sign of White, Pied or W/E showing on them either (unless someone's gonna tell me they have White throat patches, which I don't think they do)... yet I am getting some Dark Pied chicks (according to you) that are carrying one copy of W/E (according to the breeder, but I think you confirmed you saw W/E in them too, on another thread). IMO, the Peacock is the most likely candidate to be the contributor of the W/E gene. But without test breeding... you know the deal

I don't have any recent pics of him on this laptop, so these from the beginning of last year and the best I can do for now. He was only a little over 3 yrs old in these pics tho. I'll have to get on another laptop and look for some 2014 pics of him, or go take some more. (It's 96 outside right now so I don't see that happening, lol).





I realize I am new to Peas, but I am not blind, lol (and I've bred/hatched/raised hundreds of Pied Guinea Fowl for years, so White feathers always catch my eye). And I get it, splits can all be hidden but I swear to you that this bird absolutely has no White on him anywhere ('cept the normal non-feathered markings on his face). I have been catching him every evening that I collect eggs lately, running my fingers thru his train, looking at every single eye feather and looking him over every where else for White feathers. Not a one. I've done the same with my Hens. I do have a very ticked of quad of Peas out there tho, let me tell ya lol.

I really REALLY do appreciate every one's input... I'm just beyond frustrated, and in no way do I mean to come across as being snarky, snippy or a smart@ss if anyone is taking me/my comments that way. (Sorry Zaz

)


ETA (some updated pics):
It was next to impossible to get any good pics of him yesterday... but I tried. My 4 adult Peas are penned with a flock of Guineas and they were all going bonkers and trampling all over his train and making him and the Hens extra nervous/skittish so all outside pics were nothing but blur and Guinea photo bombs. I ended up having to separate the Guineas from the Peas... and unfortunately the Peas wanted in the coop, not out in the pen where I wanted them. it's not easy to get decent pics in the coop because of the lighting. But here's a few that I was able to enhance/clean up a little bit so you can hopefully get the general idea that he is not expressing any White.

 

[PeepsCA]

Quote: Yah, I expected to see White (if I was going to see it) on the irridescent part of the shell feathers too... but nope, just the White speckles down lower. Thanks for looking thru your feathers for me!