Naked Neck/Turken Thread

[Habibs Hens]

If they were from cross with Asil, the breeder could just breed to unrelated Asil to bring new blood?

I've done cross of turken with Asil(forgot which line) before they were cool looking, especially the ones that got very heavy brows, these really looked like vultures or dinosaurs.

I thought that too as NN is a dominant trait

but I guess the breeder has a lot to learn

 

[Kev]

I thought that too as NN is a dominant trait

but I guess the breeder has a lot to learn

Suggest it and see what the reply is? If the breeder assumes it's recessive, advise it's a dominant. (if that point is contested, suggest breeding naked neck with any pure bred- orp, legbar etc and let them see the results) Would like pictures if possible.

 

[Knock Kneed Hen]

This is my boy Vlad - a two year old roo

WOWZA!! That's a handsome boy. Love the deep red contrasting with the dark feathering .

 

[insanity]

I keep seeing people calling the nn gene dominate, but it only passes 50% of the time when bred to a non nn...right. Wouldn't "co-dominate" or "incomplete dominate" be more accurate?If it truly was a dominate trait any breeding would be100% nn.

 

[Kev]

I keep seeing people calling the nn gene dominate, but it only passes 50% of the time when bred to a non nn...right. Wouldn't "co-dominate" or "incomplete dominate" be more accurate?If it truly was a dominate trait any breeding would be100% nn.

Okay for this post, NN means the naked neck gene.

NN is dominant by the fact a NN bred with nonNN will produce NN offspring.

In basic genetic lessons it is assumed by default that the trait being discussed is pure in the parents being bred so NN in example would be assumed to be pure for NN and the non-NN does not have the gene in any way. The results of pure NN bred with non NN would be:

100% NN chicks. which proves NN is dominant.

The reason for "50% NN if bred with non NN" comes up so often is simply due to the fact that quite high percentages of NN are not pure for the gene. Not pure NN bred with nonNN:

50% NN 50% nonNN.

So getting half NN and not NN from this kind of cross only proves that the NN parent is not pure for the gene. Nothing more.

Co dominant is usually used for alleles- variations at a loci with more than one dominant gene.. a common example would be blood type. the type AB (two dominant genes, A and B) is perfect example of codominance. This doesn't work for NN as there's only two alleles- NN and non-NN.

Incomplete dominance is usually used for a very clear difference in something being pure or not pure for a gene. A classic example would be crossing white flower with a red flower giving a pink flower. An often used chicken example would be Andalusian blue and splash. There's no mistaking between the two.

Here's the funny part- in reality there are very very few examples of true total dominance. And there are many genes labeled recessive that you can either visually determine are carriers in some contexts or are generally able to be discerned regardless. Those terms are totally man made definitions and genes just don't care what anybody thinks.. so sometimes you just have to 'swing with it' a little bit. For example a few Andalusian blues come out with a visual splash appearence despite having only one blue gene- which seems to totally break the rules but again genes don't care about definitions.

Now back to NN.. there is a visual difference between birds pure or not pure for the NN gene. If you study and look for it, it becomes obvious(with some conditions!) but the difference is not screamingly huge like between blue and splash or pink vs red flower. It does seem like it's best to label NN as incomplete dominant but then again so few genes labeled as dominant are totally dominant.. so where's the defining line between the two? I don't know... I do admit to using plain 'dominant' because it seems it's labeled as such but try to mention the visual difference between pure and vs pure whenever possible.

 

[drumstick diva]

Is that Vlad the impaler?

 

[insanity]

I understand complex genetics having bred ball python morphs for 20 years. NN should be considered a super form of the nn codom trait. Simular to the"killer bee morph" compared to the "bumble bee morph"However I notice that chicken breeders do not seperate the 2 types(NN and Nn,). I have 2 naked hens but I know 1 is a Nn having come from a outcross breeding. Even the purebred hen only has a 50% of being NN and 50% of Nn coming from a Nn x Nn breeding.Being pets I don't care but if I was breeding I would.When purchasing horses, dogs, reptiles, ect genetic backgrounds are always listed. It helps set the cash value of the animal and allows a person to get exactly what they are after.

 

[Knock Kneed Hen]

Kev, I have a question for you. My roo is NN and I believe my one remaining frizzle hen is NN. Their offspring have all been VERY naked. ...to the point of almost being too naked. Do they reach only a certain level of nakedness? My chicks are usually completely naked, no bowtie, few feathers down the breast and underside. Thanks

 

[PsycoPeep]

Does anyone have pics of that NN X Asil cross? Or a Thai, Shamos, etc... I'd LOVE to see it!

 

[insanity]

julhale,

Vlad is stunning.