Naked Neck/Turken Thread

[cactusrota]

He’s beautiful!

I’m trying to understand how the genetics work.
Will a NN roo with a clean naked neck (no feathers) produce all NN chicks even if the mother is fully feathered?
How about if the roo has a “bow tie” or a “bib”?
Are the genes different with the hens?
My cockerel Angus has a bib and so does my pullet Emily.
Agatha, however, has a bow tie.

I find it's easy to understand if you overlay the NN gene onto a black/blue/splash genetics chart.
NaNa = two copies of the gene. Very small to no bib/bowtie. Same as Splash is two copies of the Blue gene.
Nana = one copy of the gene. Bigger bib/bowtie. Same as Blue is with one copy of the Blue gene.
nana = no gene. Fully feathered. Same as black.
If you combine a bird with two copies with a bird with no copies... ie.. NN with nn, or Splash with Black, you get all offspring with one copy. So all Nana with big bib, or all Blue.

 

[DesertChic]

He’s beautiful!

I’m trying to understand how the genetics work.
Will a NN roo with a clean naked neck (no feathers) produce all NN chicks even if the mother is fully feathered?
How about if the roo has a “bow tie” or a “bib”?
Are the genes different with the hens?
My cockerel Angus has a bib and so does my pullet Emily.
Agatha, however, has a bow tie.

@cactusrota gave a really good explanation and guide.

All I'll add is that a fully feathered "Naked Neck" will not produce any NNs unless you cross him with a NN that actually has a naked neck, even with a muff or bowtie.
(Genetically Nana + nana will yield at least one heterozygous Nana, and three fully feathered nana chicks)

If you cross two 50/50 heterozygous NNs (genetically Nana + Nana, carrying one dominant and on recessive copy of the gene), you will get NaNa (strongly NN - bowtie or muff), Nana (naked neck but probably with a larger muff), and nana (fully feathered).

Essentially, the "cleaner" the dominance of the NN gene, the more likely you are to get chickens with naked necks.

Now....here's the kicker....rose comb in NNs can create the illusion of homozygous NN (genetically NaNa) that may not even present with a bowtie or very little of one, but they may still only be heterozygous genetically. Some people actually cross their single combed NNs with rose comb birds for the sole purpose of cleaning up the neck.

 

[DesertChic]

Haha! Freakin figures. I've had a couple roosters come out looking like that, too. They're always kinda medium/large in size and really nothing that jumps out as a rooster that's worth keeping. The last one was given to a friend that lost all hers to predators, and she's loving him.
This is the one I'm gonna try using. He's really small, from El Gallo over the Transylvania girls, but he's got the least amount of color leakage of any of the black NN roosters I've hatched out so far. I plan to cross him with the NNxJG pullets and possibly the JG hens since he's homozygous.View attachment 1527836

Are you crossing him with recessive white? Or dominant white?

 

[cactusrota]

Are you crossing him with recessive white? Or dominant white?

Ya know I'm really not sure.... I think I have hens with both or either because I've gotten both offspring before.

One thing you might find interesting, though.
Notice how he doesn't have much in the way of tail feathers? Well here's his sister from the same hatch... if you'll notice she doesn't have any of the stiff tail feathers either, just the cushion coverts:

Well, here's their pitiful mom. She's one of the Transylvania girls I got last year. (she's refusing to molt, I many have to put a hen saver saddle on her just to keep her warm this winter... )

She came to me without a tail over a year ago. I thought maybe something just happened to her feathers and she would eventually grow them back. But now she's thrown two offspring already without tails. So I'm kinda curious if he or his sister are gonna throw tailless offspring as well......

I mean, they have tails, just not the stiff tail feathers. Unless I'm just not recognising it, I don't see anything wrong with her tail itself.

 

[CannedMonster]

I find it's easy to understand if you overlay the NN gene onto a black/blue/splash genetics chart.
NaNa = two copies of the gene. Very small to no bib/bowtie. Same as Splash is two copies of the Blue gene.
Nana = one copy of the gene. Bigger bib/bowtie. Same as Blue is with one copy of the Blue gene.
nana = no gene. Fully feathered. Same as black.
If you combine a bird with two copies with a bird with no copies... ie.. NN with nn, or Splash with Black, you get all offspring with one copy. So all Nana with big bib, or all Blue.View attachment 1527849

Thank you SO much!
I understand BBS genetics pretty well so that actually really cleared the NN genetics up for me.
I only have 3 Naked Neck birds and I ordered 12 sexed pullets for my cockerel and they’re all fully feathered breeds.
I didn’t know if I’d get any NN chicks out of those crosses.

 

[CannedMonster]

@cactusrota gave a really good explanation and guide.

All I'll add is that a fully feathered "Naked Neck" will not produce any NNs unless you cross him with a NN that actually has a naked neck, even with a muff or bowtie.
(Genetically Nana + nana will yield at least one heterozygous Nana, and three fully feathered nana chicks)

If you cross two 50/50 heterozygous NNs (genetically Nana + Nana, carrying one dominant and on recessive copy of the gene), you will get NaNa (strongly NN - bowtie or muff), Nana (naked neck but probably with a larger muff), and nana (fully feathered).

Essentially, the "cleaner" the dominance of the NN gene, the more likely you are to get chickens with naked necks.

Now....here's the kicker....rose comb in NNs can create the illusion of homozygous NN (genetically NaNa) that may not even present with a bowtie or very little of one, but they may still only be heterozygous genetically. Some people actually cross their single combed NNs with rose comb birds for the sole purpose of cleaning up the neck.

Rose comb birds help clean them up?
Wow.
What about pea combs?
I ordered 12 sexed pullets two months ago to provide more females for Angus.
They’re all fully feathered breeds...and one of the three Australorps turned out to be a cockerel.
I got all straight combed breeds, several varieties of Rocks and Australorps, and two EE.
Ironically I’m rehoming my 3 SL Wyandottes because they’re terrible bullies. They’re the only rose combed breeds I have.

 

[DesertChic]

Rose comb birds help clean them up?
Wow.
What about pea combs?
I ordered 12 sexed pullets two months ago to provide more females for Angus.
They’re all fully feathered breeds...and one of the three Australorps turned out to be a cockerel.
I got all straight combed breeds, several varieties of Rocks and Australorps, and two EE.
Ironically I’m rehoming my 3 SL Wyandottes because they’re terrible bullies. They’re the only rose combed breeds I have.

Yes! Pea combs! Definitely pea combs. I think it's actually pea combs. (This is why I shouldn't multi-task. I falter on the lexicon when I'm distracted. Sorry about that!)

 

[DesertChic]

Ya know I'm really not sure.... I think I have hens with both or either because I've gotten both offspring before.

One thing you might find interesting, though.
Notice how he doesn't have much in the way of tail feathers? Well here's his sister from the same hatch... if you'll notice she doesn't have any of the stiff tail feathers either, just the cushion coverts:View attachment 1528052
Well, here's their pitiful mom. She's one of the Transylvania girls I got last year. (she's refusing to molt, I many have to put a hen saver saddle on her just to keep her warm this winter... )
View attachment 1528054
She came to me without a tail over a year ago. I thought maybe something just happened to her feathers and she would eventually grow them back. But now she's thrown two offspring already without tails. So I'm kinda curious if he or his sister are gonna throw tailless offspring as well...... View attachment 1528056

I mean, they have tails, just not the stiff tail feathers. Unless I'm just not recognising it, I don't see anything wrong with her tail itself.

I've had a few birds that were very slow to grow tail feathers as well. I'm not sure exactly what it is in the genetics that causes that. And....I had one girl that remained devoid of feathers for an entire year. She's actually one of my hardiest, healthiest and most productive birds, but once she started molt she just didn't regrow feathers for a full year. Now...she's gone nearly another year without losing any feathers.

 

[chickengr]

I've had a few birds that were very slow to grow tail feathers as well. I'm not sure exactly what it is in the genetics that causes that. And....I had one girl that remained devoid of feathers for an entire year. She's actually one of my hardiest, healthiest and most productive birds, but once she started molt she just didn't regrow feathers for a full year. Now...she's gone nearly another year without losing any feathers.
View attachment 1528243

my marans girls look somewhat like that. although I have 1 roo with 8 hens they have been overmated.

 

[chickengr]

in another thread I have read that size of the chicks depend on hens, not on roos. we should hatch big eggs only if we want big chicks.