Need pipping help quick!

[fowlweatherfriends]

I need help quick-not much movement from the pipped chick now. Here's what I wrote in the eggs to hatch section:

Ok, I have 4 left to go... One has it's beak through, but isn't doing too much-been this way for about 6 to 7 hours-still moving a bit though. The next one has broken a piece of shell off and I can sees the membrane, but I am not seeing much other movement.

And the 2 with side air pockets I was thinking about intervention. I can hear tapping from one of the eggs. There is so much racket going on due to the chicks already hatched.

Should I take the dried off chicks out of the bator so I can hear the
unhatched ones? I can't hear if there is any cheeping going on due to all the noise.

I need help deciding whether or not to help them, and if so, how?​

 

[MayberrySaint]

I have not personally incubated and hatched eggs, but in reading threads in this forum, it appears helping the chick out of it's shell can have lethal consequences. I read one thread where it took 48 hours for the chick to get completely hatched and that chicks take frequent rest breaks during the process. I wouldn't panic yet.

Andy

 

[CarriBrown]

It can take 24 hours after the first pip for them to hatch. I would hold tight for now.
Good luck!

 

[fowlweatherfriends]

The one that broke its beak throught the shell and membrane has a dried out membrane. It seems to be getting weeker. I put drops of water on the membrane area but she is not attampting to get out.

The other chick has broken off a section of shell and a large piece of membrane is showing, it looks as if it has torn a "gash" in the membrane and it is crying loudly.

I wet a washcloth with warm water and slightly wrapped them in it with their pipped areas facing up. Is there anything else to do?

How can a chick bleed to death? When does the part that makes them bleed actually separate from the chick? Are the bleeding things in the bottom of the shell, so that if you help them out of the membrane you could do it from the top?

 

[robin416]

The membrane is full of blood vessels. When a chick pips too soon there can be bleeding or if a human intervenes too soon there can be bleeding. Helping a chick finish its hatch is one of those things that your instincts have to be good along with experience in helping.

I help, I do it all of the time with very good results. I've yet to lose a chick to intervention by me.

How many hours has it been since these two pipped?
What was the hatch date?
Did the others hatch on time?
Do you have a forced air incubator?

Once the chicks penetrate the outside shell even when the humidity is right on the membrane has a tendancy to dry and begin to shrink warp the chick.

How are you hearing tapping? The only way that is possible is if you are taking the egg out of the bator.

 

[jimnjay]

I agree with Robin, It is important to leave the incubator closed during the hatching process. 24 hours is a golden rule when considering to help. That would be if the egg is on day 21. It sounds like the one that has broken the shell and torn the membrane is on its way out. The other one may be stuck. Sometimes there are weaklings and they just don't have what it takes to hatch. You will be surprised how long they can be in the shell before they make the valient effort to hatch.

You might try to help the other one after the one making progress is out. You can mess us the environment by opening the incubator. If you decide to help try to remove just the shell in a circle around the site of the pip just as the chick would. Put it back in and see if it is able to break free of the membrane. Make sure it is dampened with warm water at that point. Proceed in several hours if it does not make any progress. I always help but I make them do some of the work too. It is so hard to decide what is right. You sort of have to be there.

I can tell you this, on the one that I have helped, they all were raising a fuss at 24 hours. I had one that did not make it a few weeks ago and it pipped and died before I could make a decision to help or not. This chick was just not up for the journey. Good luck

 

[fowlweatherfriends]

Good news: I helped, and they are alive and well

!
I am running out the door, but will update this afternoon. Both chicks absolutely needed help due to wierd things with their situation. Very interesting story. Stay tuned...

 

[Llysse]

So... what were the details? I'm anxious to hear!

 

[fowlweatherfriends]

Hi Llysse,
I am so swamped since the chicks hatched! I will be writing my "essay" tonight about what happened. It was the neatest experience I have had in a long time

.
I did so well I feel like a chicken MD.

Just got back from wally world and have to put up the groceries, get kids to bed, hug and kiss my baby chicks and put them to bed...
THEN I should be able to post

 

[fowlweatherfriends]

Ok, this may be long but interesting and maybe helpful to others with this situation.

I'll set the situation up:
18 eggs in incubator:9 OEGB and 9 Silkie
The 2 silkies having trouble had pipped early in the hatch.
All others hatched BEFORE I opened the bator to intervene.
The temp held at 100 degrees in Little Giant still air.
Humidity was 70 to 76 % (before and during the hatch).

The 2 that had trouble:
The first of the 2 to pip (Baby2, as I call her) was able to get the beak through on the correct wider end and peep for hours. I noticed her getting stiller and stiller towards the end of all others having hatched out. Found out through intervention the air cell was in the middle of the egg-not the wide end.

The second chick had pipped at the NARROW end of the shell, was cheeping loudly and moving beak side to side for hours (this one really wanted out). The air cell was in correct position, but chick was breech-pipped in narrow end.

The intervention:
Baby2 was helped first. Took her completely out of bator. Held her as I used DULL tweezers to gently remove eggshell around her pip (she was not able to "zip" around the entire shell). Discovered her membrane was completely dry. Added drops of water to the exposed membrane that I had help "zip". Also added drops to the INSIDE of membrane where her beak was not in danger (so I helped wet membrane internally as well as externally. I then used a very wet washcloth and wrapped the chick (in remaining shell) with beak pointing up and not covered with wet cloth. Replaced her to bator.

Second silkie: Same process, but I additionally found the air cell, and chipped away the shell at the air cell to give more mobility. Also wet chick from inside and outside membrane. This membrane had dried also, and the chick was not able to "zip". I think this one had trouble zipping due to being breech (in the wrong end).

I repeated this process of removing a bit more shell and wetting the membrane several times over several night hours. I then started adding some lifting of the membrane to help them out a bit. The first, Baby2, had a tiny bit of bleeding, and I stopped and restarted an hour or so later.

Their hatch:
Fell to sleep exhausted and woke up four hours later to lots of chirping. Both had made it out of the shell/membrane and were begining to dry. I fell confident that had I not helped, they both would have perished. I truly believe that the "survival of the fittest" does not always apply. In my case, both chicks had problems hatching based on egg issues such as air cell and or being breech. The second chick is as perky, healthy and happy as can be.

Update on chick #1 (Baby2). I'll call her a her. Her health has fluctuated greatly. First 1 1/2 days she was up, cheeping, eating, drinking, and playing with the rest. As day 2 progressed, she apparently developed spraddle leg although no others got it. I bandaid-ed her legs and she was up strraight and eating well. Day 3 she started sitting down and refusing to stand. She looked weak and I started helping her drink. I also started mixing some liquid food for her: a combination of finely crumbled starter, tiny amount of sugar, tiny amount of apple cider vinegar, and water. I have fed her through a tiny shot syringe and she now seems to be rebounding a bit.

I think Baby2 may or may not make it. she has had some uphill battles and may be one of those geneticaly not up to living-but to me, it is very worth the effort of at least trying (I am always the person who sees the glass as half full, not half empty). As long as she is chirping and eating and making an effort to stand (she is a fighter), and does not appear to be suffering, I will endeavor to help her along. If she makes it through her physical challenges she may end up being my house chicken

.

Summary: (Sorry it's so long)
In my case instinct proved good and timing was good to help chicks out. I did have a feeling that Baby2 had some genetic issues even as I helped her when she was inside the shell. But to my children and I, we think that every chick like every human deserves a chance.