Rooster Crowing Behaviour - Is it Easily Heritable?

[Aunt Angus]

Yeah I know!

I didn't know they even existed till a year back! I can't believe such a cute creature's even real!!

Right???!!!! I'm right there with you!

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

It was just a random hypothesis, could be wrong. I have noticed that my domesticated turkeys gobble more than wild turkeys, and my domesticated coturnix quail crow more than wild quail. I've had lots of different rooster breeds and so far the aseels crow the least. My bantams crowed the most. I think they had Little dog syndrome.

I think you are making correct observations. The character and use of crowing is genetic.

Wild red junglefowl are seasonal breeders, just as wild turkey are. Therefore a wild red junglefowl cock usually confines crowing, as well as his bright plumage, to the breeding season. During the off season the wild red junglefowl cock will flush his male hormones out, turn dark, and take on more feminine characteristics. Think about what a whitetail buck does after the breeding season is over. He loses his antlers and muscle mass and spends late winter and early spring looking and acting much like a doe. So it is with a wild red junglefowl.

Apparently that sort of seasonal behavior isn’t written in genetic stone because we selectively bred much of it out of domestic chickens. We morphed them into being mostly year round breeders in warm areas and springtime and summertime breeders in temperate climates. The only semblance of the seasonal breeding we have left is the molting period and even that can be manipulated. A rooster that has a cocky disposition for most of the year is a better breeder and a better fighter than one that has very seasonal hormones (remember chickens were domesticated for cockfighting before they were domesticated for food).

The original red junglefowl crow cuts off the last syllable so it sounds shorter than our typical domestic chicken crow. My junglefowl are hybrids and have a full domestic crow. My original hybrid line (that I call Crackers) crows at daylight and dusk and rarely crows during the day. My American game bantam line (which is an equal part OEGB) crows throughout the day. However there are also other factors at play. My AGBs are confined to coops while my Crackers free range. My Crackers are under a singular brood cock that kills rivals of similar age so he has no challengers in the farmyard. The cooped birds each have one brood cock among several hens and can see each other and act like they’re trying to one up another with their crows.

I’ve noticed that both my Cracker and my AGB cocks will tolerate teenage stags and that the stags for their part will exhibit shrunken combs and duller plumage when living with the brood cocks. Those stags rarely crow. If separated into their own coops with hens, those stags will develop bright red, large combs and bright plumage and will crow regularly. Therefore I’ve come to suspect there is a process by which stags regulate their hormones as to not to offend the dominant brood cock. This process seems to last until the 18 month molt. Afterwards they come out of that molt looking and acting cocky and get themselves killed.

My Crackers give a warning gobble when they see danger. It sounds very much like a turkey gobble. I suspect that when the ancestors of wild turkeys came to North America they were more chicken-like and over time the proto-turkeys switched their crow for the warning gobble and the warning gobble became their crow. That’s probably why turkeys “shock gobble” when they’re startled.

I am a turkey hunter. I have observed that among wild turkeys in the spring time, the frequency of their gobbling has a lot to do with their genetics (some subspecies of wild turkey gobble more or less than others), weather conditions, and predator pressure. Wild turkeys that are preyed heavily upon my coyotes are often exceptionally quiet. Its a common hunting technique of coyotes for them to key in on a turkey roost by the gobbling of a gobbler and attempt to ambush the turkeys when they fly down at daylight. I have often watched coyotes come running in to the sound of a gobbler intensely gobbling. In areas where that happens a lot, the turkeys learn to be quiet. I’m sure crowing in chickens could so similarly be suppressed by learned factors.

 

[MysteryChicken]

Hello fellow BYCers! This topic has been mentioned in several postings in various threads but I thought I'll try and compile more empirical evidence of people's experiences with their Roosters from just this thread. What I'll like to find out in particular is if anyone has any Rooster/s that:

1. Doesn't crow frequently
2. Has a very soft crow AND/OR
3. Doesn't crow at all

If you answer "yes" to any of the three above, can you share your experience of whether any of your Rooster/s male babies inherited the same trait? There are arguments that crowing behaviour is purely environmental. The info I've gathered so far also suggests it can be inherited.

Thank you!

I have a cockerel who inherited his father's loud screaming crow. I still need to get a video.

 

[CNJ]

I have a cockerel who inherited his father's loud screaming crow. I still need to get a video.

lol.

 

[klb25]

I think you are making correct observations. The character and use of crowing is genetic.

Wild red junglefowl are seasonal breeders, just as wild turkey are. Therefore a wild red junglefowl cock usually confines crowing, as well as his bright plumage, to the breeding season. During the off season the wild red junglefowl cock will flush his male hormones out, turn dark, and take on more feminine characteristics. Think about what a whitetail buck does after the breeding season is over. He loses his antlers and muscle mass and spends late winter and early spring looking and acting much like a doe. So it is with a wild red junglefowl.

Apparently that sort of seasonal behavior isn’t written in genetic stone because we selectively bred much of it out of domestic chickens. We morphed them into being mostly year round breeders in warm areas and springtime and summertime breeders in temperate climates. The only semblance of the seasonal breeding we have left is the molting period and even that can be manipulated. A rooster that has a cocky disposition for most of the year is a better breeder and a better fighter than one that has very seasonal hormones (remember chickens were domesticated for cockfighting before they were domesticated for food).

The original red junglefowl crow cuts off the last syllable so it sounds shorter than our typical domestic chicken crow. My junglefowl are hybrids and have a full domestic crow. My original hybrid line (that I call Crackers) crows at daylight and dusk and rarely crows during the day. My American game bantam line (which is an equal part OEGB) crows throughout the day. However there are also other factors at play. My AGBs are confined to coops while my Crackers free range. My Crackers are under a singular brood cock that kills rivals of similar age so he has no challengers in the farmyard. The cooped birds each have one brood cock among several hens and can see each other and act like they’re trying to one up another with their crows.

That's really interesting to read. I have a red junglefowl roo. I like his truncated crow but he does it a LOT.

I have one other boy who is a mutt (there was a lengthy post about him a few days ago). He has a very soft, short, gentle crow. I'm hoping he will make some chicks that will take after him in that regard, but I don't think that the odds are ever in my favor.

 

[SarahGfa]

I have often watched coyotes come running in to the sound of a gobbler intensely gobbling. In areas where that happens a lot, the turkeys learn to be quiet. I’m sure crowing in chickens could so similarly be suppressed by learned factors.

That was an enlightening read and thank you for weighing in. Do you think the turkeys "learn" to be quiet or did the noisy ones got eaten so the turkeys evolved to be quiet through natural selection? I think it's an automatic reflex that can't be trained away. My turkeys gobble whenever someone claps hands, slams a door, starts an air compressor, passes gas, anything. If you could figure out how to "teach" a bird to be quiet I bet you could make a lot of money.

 

[SarahGfa]

I have a cockerel who inherited his father's loud screaming crow. I still need to get a video.

Is it ayam ketawa? Those roosters give me the creeps.

 

[MysteryChicken]

Is it ayam ketawa? Those roosters give me the creeps.

No, I don't have those. It's a Heritage Plymouth Barred Rock rooster, & a Buff Orpington/Heritage Plymouth Barred Rock mix cockerel.

 

[ChookieG]

I think you are making correct observations. The character and use of crowing is genetic.

Wild red junglefowl are seasonal breeders, just as wild turkey are. Therefore a wild red junglefowl cock usually confines crowing, as well as his bright plumage, to the breeding season. During the off season the wild red junglefowl cock will flush his male hormones out, turn dark, and take on more feminine characteristics. Think about what a whitetail buck does after the breeding season is over. He loses his antlers and muscle mass and spends late winter and early spring looking and acting much like a doe. So it is with a wild red junglefowl.

Apparently that sort of seasonal behavior isn’t written in genetic stone because we selectively bred much of it out of domestic chickens. We morphed them into being mostly year round breeders in warm areas and springtime and summertime breeders in temperate climates. The only semblance of the seasonal breeding we have left is the molting period and even that can be manipulated. A rooster that has a cocky disposition for most of the year is a better breeder and a better fighter than one that has very seasonal hormones (remember chickens were domesticated for cockfighting before they were domesticated for food).

The original red junglefowl crow cuts off the last syllable so it sounds shorter than our typical domestic chicken crow. My junglefowl are hybrids and have a full domestic crow. My original hybrid line (that I call Crackers) crows at daylight and dusk and rarely crows during the day. My American game bantam line (which is an equal part OEGB) crows throughout the day. However there are also other factors at play. My AGBs are confined to coops while my Crackers free range. My Crackers are under a singular brood cock that kills rivals of similar age so he has no challengers in the farmyard. The cooped birds each have one brood cock among several hens and can see each other and act like they’re trying to one up another with their crows.

I’ve noticed that both my Cracker and my AGB cocks will tolerate teenage stags and that the stags for their part will exhibit shrunken combs and duller plumage when living with the brood cocks. Those stags rarely crow. If separated into their own coops with hens, those stags will develop bright red, large combs and bright plumage and will crow regularly. Therefore I’ve come to suspect there is a process by which stags regulate their hormones as to not to offend the dominant brood cock. This process seems to last until the 18 month molt. Afterwards they come out of that molt looking and acting cocky and get themselves killed.

My Crackers give a warning gobble when they see danger. It sounds very much like a turkey gobble. I suspect that when the ancestors of wild turkeys came to North America they were more chicken-like and over time the proto-turkeys switched their crow for the warning gobble and the warning gobble became their crow. That’s probably why turkeys “shock gobble” when they’re startled.

I am a turkey hunter. I have observed that among wild turkeys in the spring time, the frequency of their gobbling has a lot to do with their genetics (some subspecies of wild turkey gobble more or less than others), weather conditions, and predator pressure. Wild turkeys that are preyed heavily upon my coyotes are often exceptionally quiet. Its a common hunting technique of coyotes for them to key in on a turkey roost by the gobbling of a gobbler and attempt to ambush the turkeys when they fly down at daylight. I have often watched coyotes come running in to the sound of a gobbler intensely gobbling. In areas where that happens a lot, the turkeys learn to be quiet. I’m sure crowing in chickens could so similarly be suppressed by learned factors.

Very interesting observations. I summize from what you've said is environmental pressures can inadvertently affect genetic outcomes?

If so then let's hope that the principles of Epigenetics would play a dominant role in the selection of the chicken crow, which I mentioned in a previous posting that was discussing 'no crow roosters'. A cut-and-paste from that post for ease of reading: Essentially what we're seeing so far in the rather recent field of Epigenetics is that environmental influences/changes can be heretible in mammals. And this is contrary to the common norm that permanent changes in the DNA code have to occur for it to be passed down to the next generation so it is scientifically possible to inherit physical traits that are due to environmental influence/s.

Thanks for your input @Florida Bullfrog.

 

[ChookieG]

That's really interesting to read. I have a red junglefowl roo. I like his truncated crow but he does it a LOT.

I have one other boy who is a mutt (there was a lengthy post about him a few days ago). He has a very soft, short, gentle crow. I'm hoping he will make some chicks that will take after him in that regard, but I don't think that the odds are ever in my favor.

Hey @klb25, will be nice if you could update us on the crowing outcome of his boys in the near future??