Shadrach's Ex Battery and Rescued chickens thread.

[TropicalChickies]

I think they actually do use regular sulfur in vineyards - it is used in gardens to prevent mildew and I think is commonly used in vineyards.
But that has nothing to do with what is in the wine (sulfites) and nothing to do with headaches.
Sulfur is an element present in nature. It is in the same group of elements as carbon and like carbon is essential to all known life.
Sulfur is non-toxic - but some compounds that include sulfur are toxic (e.g. hydrogen sulfide - which smells like rotten eggs), just like carbon is benign but carbon monoxide can be rapidly fatal if inhaled.

Sorry for the chemistry lecture (I love chemistry!). I will go find some tax now.

Sulfur is also an approved input for organic farming as a fertilizer, insecticide and fungicide in all countries with organic certifications and standards, including (@BDutch you may want to be informed)

The European Economic Community (EEC) Council Regulation (EEC No 2092/91) and carried over by Article 16(3)(c) of Regulation No 834/2007, permits the use of sulfur as a fungicide, acaricide, and repellent in organic food production.

If you search "sulfur approved for organic farming in (insert place), multiple pdfs are available.

 

[TropicalChickies]

Chickens are already at a health disadvantage by roosting in coops. The least we can do is try to minimize the amount of dust and chemicals, natural or not, that they inhale while shut in the coop. Bags of sulfur hanging in or around the coop entrance that the chickens are supposed to bang into, causing a cloud of chemical dust to settle on their feathers which they then shake, further agitating the dust cannot be a good idea.

Well, I'm certainly not here to argue with experience, however, if one less seasoned individual such as myself searches "sulfur for lice on chickens" as I have done on the canon on untruth aka the Internet, one is subjected to several pages of results -- from pop science to blog posts to scholarly pdfs -- extolling the effectiveness of the bad idea.

Needless to say, after such an indictment, I will remove these irritating sachets immediately.

That being said, I will be trying to combat the lice present on the chickens by carefully applying sulfur directly to their affected areas, which for all of them, is that spot in the back of the neck where it's difficult for them to reach when preening and their porcupiney new feathers are sprouting. I've also removed as much of that feather casing stuff as I can manually from each bird. I can also go back to using sulfur mixed into a mild soap solution which has been effective in the past. Permethrin doesn't appear to be working. It kills the lice present but I think I need something that stays on their skin longer to try to prevent new lice from jumping back on.

There's no lice in their coops, both if which are plastic, bamboo, and/or cob that have 4 meter high roofs, open air all around, and no doors. I'm pretty sure the chickens are picking up lice from wild birds. The Choco Andino Cloudforest is one of the most diverse bird habitats in the world. There are more species of birds here than in the Amazon rainforest and it's a top birdwatching destination. I'm not a "birder" but visitors to our reforested areas have told me they have identified more than a hundred species during their stays.

The natural shade area where the chickens go to rest and digest their meals houses at least a dozen types of wild birds. All of them probable vectors of lice, fleas, or mites.

There's nothing I can or even want to do about the presence of so many wild birds sharing space with the chickens. Increasing the biodiversity of this formerly deforested land is one of our chief aims. The chickens would need to be kept in a sterile bubble to avoid other birds and bugs here, and that's not happening. If I have to treat the chickens one by one, that's fine, it's what I've been doing all along anyway.

 

[TropicalChickies]

Taxes. Lucio treating his ladies to afternoon snacks.

 

[BDutch]

Probably. It is generally accepted that decent levels of ventilation is desirable in a chicken coop. Just for the moment, let's not dwell on the difference between ventilation and air flow. The reason good ventilation is important is because damp air with ammonia fumes from chicken poop is harmful to their respiratory systems. There is also the matter of other pathogens that thrive in warm damp environments. So, what we are aiming for is a dry, well ventilated coop. However, dry chicken coops tend to be dusty chicken coops and air movement in dry dusty coops creates dust particles in the air. Many people who have dry coops wear a mask when cleaning them out because, dust and dander and all those pathogens are considered harmful if inhaled. This applies to the chickens as well. Then it seems some people wish to add more dust to an already dusty environment, these dusts being known to be respiratory irritants. I don't need a COSHH sheet to tell me it's a very bad idea. Chickens are already at a health disadvantage by roosting in coops. The least we can do is try to minimize the amount of dust and chemicals, natural or not, that they inhale while shut in the coop. Bags of sulfur hanging in or around the coop entrance that the chickens are supposed to bang into, causing a cloud of chemical dust to settle on their feathers which they then shake, further agitating the dust cannot be a good idea. Best option, build a coop that can be sanitized with a blow torch. Chemical free solution. Build a coop that isn't friendly for the parasites and pathogens one is trying to deal with, plastic coops for example. Don't keep chickens in coops, even better option. Build secure run with open shelter. If one has to use chemicals then do it away from the coop if possible.

Part of this is an opinion. Good if it works for you. I agree that a huge amount of fresh air is good for my chickens in my climate. Even in winter. But on some points I do /choose differently.

I was curious for a pdf report like the one on sulfur from your gov health department. I have never seen any proof that DE is poisonous or irritating on skin. Only warnings to apply it carefully or with a mask and to be careful with the chickens breathing it in when applied. After its mixed with ordinary sand this is not a hazard anymore according to my supplier..

No way you can convince me thats its nice to live in a plastic house for my chickens because I know it isn’t nice for people either. The only advantage I see is the more easy mite control and cleaning.

I use loam paint on the walls inside my house instead of latex for a healthier personal environment. Loam paint with a chalk/wood layer underneath is great for a breathable wall. And diminishes chances on mold. It soaks moist in when its dry and releases it when its dry. ASBP did a lot of research on this topic, gives information and training courses as well.
https://asbp.org.uk/

tax for the human house chatting:

 

[RoyalChick]

Well, I'm certainly not here to argue with experience, however, if one less seasoned individual such as myself searches "sulfur for lice on chickens" as I have done on the canon on untruth aka the Internet, one is subjected to several pages of results -- from pop science to blog posts to scholarly pdfs -- extolling the effectiveness of the bad idea.
View attachment 3643982
Needless to say, after such an indictment, I will remove these irritating sachets immediately.

That being said, I will be trying to combat the lice present on the chickens by carefully applying sulfur directly to their affected areas, which for all of them, is that spot in the back of the neck where it's difficult for them to reach when preening and their porcupiney new feathers are sprouting. I've also removed as much of that feather casing stuff as I can manually from each bird. I can also go back to using sulfur mixed into a mild soap solution which has been effective in the past. Permethrin doesn't appear to be working. It kills the lice present but I think I need something that stays on their skin longer to try to prevent new lice from jumping back on.

There's no lice in their coops, both if which are plastic, bamboo, and/or cob that have 4 meter high roofs, open air all around, and no doors. I'm pretty sure the chickens are picking up lice from wild birds. The Choco Andino Cloudforest is one of the most diverse bird habitats in the world. There are more species of birds here than in the Amazon rainforest and it's a top birdwatching destination. I'm not a "birder" but visitors to our reforested areas have told me they have identified more than a hundred species during their stays.

The natural shade area where the chickens go to rest and digest their meals houses at least a dozen types of wild birds. All of them probable vectors of lice, fleas, or mites.

There's nothing I can or even want to do about the presence of so many wild birds sharing space with the chickens. Increasing the biodiversity of this formerly deforested land is one of our chief aims. The chickens would need to be kept in a sterile bubble to avoid other birds and bugs here, and that's not happening. If I have to treat the chickens one by one, that's fine, it's what I've been doing all along anyway.

So far I have only used sulfur on myself. And so far I haven’t seen any crawlies in the Chicken Palace or on the chickens.

I do find my Chicken Palace gets too dry and dusty as Shad describes, and so I hose it down from time to time and empty the water on to the litter when I bring fresh for them.

 

[MrsNorthie]

Well, I'm certainly not here to argue with experience, however, if one less seasoned individual such as myself searches "sulfur for lice on chickens" as I have done on the canon on untruth aka the Internet, one is subjected to several pages of results -- from pop science to blog posts to scholarly pdfs -- extolling the effectiveness of the bad idea.

I have found the same thing, with sulfur, DE, almost every home cure for almost everything, but I tend to steer clear of anything that creates dust. I once had a pool filter that used DE and I was always terrified of adding more, when required, and never let my children or pets anywhere near during the process.

The vinegar worked with the fire ants, and I started using it, slightly diluted as a coop cleaner. We haven't had any mites or lice yet, but I am wondering, as far as an environmental treatment, if it would help with your lice issue?

I found this recipe for a spray that is mostly referenced as being effective against mites, but garlic and vinegar was referenced in this article for use against lice https://petkeen.com/how-to-naturally-rid-chicken-mites-lice/:

CHICKEN MITE TREATMENT SPRAY​

• 25 cloves garlic, peeled and smashed (or 1 oz garlic extract)
• 45 drops eucalyptus essential oil
• 30 drops lavender essential oil
• 30 drops peppermint essential oil
• 20 drops cinnamon bark essential oil
• 2 tbs white vinegar or witch hazel (unless using garlic extract)
• Water

The essential oils are really optional, but they do maximize the efficiency of this spray.

Method:

1. In a 16 oz. glass spray bottle, combine garlic (or extract) and essential oils. If using smashed garlic, allow it to sit for several hours before using.
2. If using garlic extract, do not use white vinegar. Fill the rest of the bottle up with water ¾ of the way full. If using smashed garlic, add vinegar.
3. Shake the bottle well before each spray. Spray directly on the skin of the chicken, concentrating only on the neck, the vent area, and the top of the tail where the oil gland is. I also spray their feet and the roosting bar base so that when they lay back down on their feet and roost, the mixture gets onto their bellies. Do this treatment at night after they’ve gone to roost.
4. Continue this treatment for two weeks, then twice a week for two weeks, to rid your chickens of mites. You can continue to dust your chickens with wood ash once a week, but it may not be necessary.

I think your mild tropical climate lends itself to being ideal for the various parasites. Moderate to warm humid temps, lots of vegetation and abundance of wildlife... at least here, we get a lot of dry periods and the occasional cold days, to help.

 

[L-plate chicken mum]

Is the a pdf like this one for DE too?

Think this is the one: https://www.nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/0616.pdf

 

[Perris]

The Choco Andino Cloudforest is one of the most diverse bird habitats in the world. There are more species of birds here than in the Amazon rainforest and it's a top birdwatching destination. I'm not a "birder" but visitors to our reforested areas have told me they have identified more than a hundred species during their stays.

wow! lucky you! Do you catch a glimpse of some of them sometimes? Do any ever join your flock, as Coed the pheasant sometimes does mine?

 

[Little Tala Bug]

If anyone else wants to chime in, please do. Thank you.

I have no experience with sulfur, but just wanted to chime in with what I did experience lately just in case the sulfur doesn't work for you. I used a powder product containing Eucalyptus Citriodora on my pretty heavily infested chickens and it seemed to have worked. https://www.flytesofancy.co.uk/products/battles-poultry-red-mite-powder-500g

I patted the powder pretty liberally on their underside, tail, under wings, and neck area. It is a very fine powder which puffs up into the air easily, so we got the chickens after dark, took them out of their coops, and treated them on a table outside where they wouldn't be confined in an environment full of dust in the air.

We went back to reapply just over a week later since I heard the eggs hatch and the cycle starts over. During the reapplication process we didn't find a single adult louse on any of our 25 chickens (all of whom were infested before), and we didn't find any lice eggs sacs on any chickens except one (who is our biggest chicken so might not have been able to reach her vent area to preen them off her feathers). We found SO MANY eggs sacs the first time round, so it seems to have worked very well. I had also read that applying oil to the egg sacs at the base of the feathers will prevent them from hatching. We sprayed a bit of eucalyptus citriodora oil on our big chicken when we inspected her the second time around, just to be sure.

It has been a few weeks since then and they all seem normal. I should check them out one more time just in case, but overall I am very happy with how it turned out.

 

[BDutch]

Think this is the one: https://www.nj.gov/health/eoh/rtkweb/documents/fs/0616.pdf

Thanks this is what I was looking for, but unfortunately it is too complicated to read. I use the light brown, food grade and not heated DE. I’m afraid I misinterpret it.

Do the hazards as described in the document refer to the food grade DE or the heated more chemical substance?