Sustainable meat bird

[HenriettaPizzaNolan]

You could still order straight run and process the cockerels, if you are willing to do them ayes soon as they start crowing (so maybe around 8 weeks, plus or minus a few.) Of course, they will not be anywhere close to Cornish Cross size at that age, but they are edible at any size. And the younger you process them, the more tender they are.

Yes but unfortunately it would defeat the purpose of keeping the sustainable breed, because I can't get them to the age to reproduce anyway. So I think for now I'll stick to Cornish X for meat. I'm still interested in some of these heritage meat breeds that I can use as layers too though.

 

[Sneakyturtle]

You don't want much, do you? I'm not picking on you. To be honest a whole lot of people on this forum want the same thing.

That leaves out the Cornish Cross. While they are hybrids and won't breed true that isn't the big problem. If you could breed them even their poorer offspring would still make tremendous meat birds. It's just too hard to keep them alive and healthy enough to breed and lay eggs. The Rangers are somewhat in the same boat. They may be a bit easier but easier does not mean easy. They would still be a big challenge to breed.

Some people have used CX or Rangers to cross with a dual purpose chicken to create their own line of meat birds, usually hens of one of these with a dual purpose rooster. You only need to keep the hens alive long enough to get some eggs to hatch so you have your breeding stock. These will not breed true in the first generations but it doesn't take that many generations of selective breeding before you consistently get pretty good birds. There are some good threads on this forum detailing how some people have approached that.

There is a common fallacy on this forum that some people believe all birds of a specific breed have exactly the same traits. That is not even close to true. If a specific breeder breeds for good egg laying flock they can have a strain of that breed that lays really well. If a different breeder breeds the same breed for meat qualities they can develop a strain of the same breed that might not lay really well but makes a good meat bird. That's why I hesitate to mention breeds but Ilike posts like @BrennaM 's because it is talking about strains.

Different people like different qualities in a meat bird. You mentioned fast grower. That is a real common trait we like. What age do you plan to butcher them? One person in here likes to butcher at 14 weeks so that is his fast grower target. I like butchering later, say 23 weeks, so that's more my target. Some people like the big breeds like Brahma or Jersey Giants, but those are slow maturing. You are probably talking months instead of weeks for them. A lot of that is how we cook them, different ages can require different cooking methods.

Are you buying all the feed they eat or will you grow most of it or rely on forage? If you are buying it then early maturing might be more important for feed costs than otherwise.

How many do you want to hatch a year, whether you eat all of them or sell some? Is this just for your table or are you planning on going commercial? How important is this to you? Is it worth a big commitment from you or is it more casual?

The better your starting stock the better your flock will be. But you have to select your own breeding stock to maintain top quality. Getting good birds to start with is only part of the process.

Do you pluck your birds or do you skin them? If you skin them it doesn't matter, but you get a prettier carcass when you pluck if you start with a white or buff bird. The darker pin feathers left behind are really noticeable on a plucked bird. Would that bother you?

Back in the mid 1900's before the Cornish X took over the meat bird market in the US the most popular meat market breeds were Delaware, New Hampshire, and certain strains of the White Rock. When the CX took over the hatcheries stopped breeding specifically these for meat bird traits so these days most hatchery birds of these breeds aren't any better for meat than many other dual purpose breeds. If you can find a breeder that knows what they are doing and is breeding for meat traits you can get some good initial stock. Many breeders breeding for show have good sized stock. But you will pay a price for these, they don't sell them at hatchery prices.

If your only goals were a lot of cheap meat, you can't beat the Cornish X even with buying the chicks. You can probably buy the meat at the store cheaper than you can raise it, especially if you put a price on your time. Some people go that route. Many of us have different goals and prefer to go another way.

I obviously cannot come close to telling you which might be best for you. I've probably added stuff that makes it sound more complicated than it has to be. My suggestion is to read threads on here, ask any questions that come up, and then try something. I know you want to avoid the trial and error, that's why you ask questions. But the only way to really know what is important to you is to experience it. Some things I thought important to me weren't really. Some things I never thought of were.

Haha nah not asking too much in a perfect world, I would like something as close to the CX as I can get but that can live long enough to breed and is healthier than the CX. I’d like to butcher as soon as possible, ideally around 12 or so weeks. I will be buying their feed but they can forage as well, I raise my roosters in an over grown pasture. Their area is 100x100 surrounded with electric netting.

I would probably just do 50 or so birds a year for myself. If I hatched any more than that, I would sell them as chicks. Definitely not planning on going commercial, just for my family. Sometimes I pluck, sometimes I skin, it would be preferable to have a white bird but it’s not the most important attribute.

I know it’s not cheaper to raise my own chickens for the most part, but I like being self sufficient as much as possible and knowing where my food comes from. Looking back on the amount I have spent on my egg layers is depressing, each of my eggs is probably worth $5

I’ll spend more time exploring the threads on this page. I have a couple breeds in mind, but wanted to see what others would suggest.

 

[Sneakyturtle]

You got some really great feedback already!

For me the best bird is one you enjoy keeping.

My definition of fast growing and naturally reproductive is around 16 weeks for harvest age and 24-30 weeks is slow.

Bielefelder dressed out average 4# at 16 weeks (20% protein feed and free range one acre), and with auto sexing bonus female chicks can be sold as sexed pullets at hatch or even harvested too come that time. I wouldn't call them economic without some chick sells.. as they are heavy ladies.. but they were easy keepers.

I'm gonna suggest (white) Rock or Naked Neck Turken. I've raised both..

The article that follows has some comparisons with some of the breeds being discussed.. I had to verify not robot to view but it was a good read..

https://smallfarmersjournal.com/heritage-breed-broiler-chickens/

Wyandotte's have been nice table birds.

I have a couple Bielefelders. They do get big fast, they are one of the breeds I am considering using for my meat chicken flock. Autosexing chicks are easy to sell in my area so I have thought about doing that and selling the female chicks and processing the males. I have some naked necks too but mine don’t grow very fast.

 

[Just Ranchin]

We plan to get American Bresse birds next season. Living Tradition Homestead has started raising them and showed some butchered. I was impressed by what I saw. They breed well from my research and are good for eggs as well. We will probably just get straight run and butcher the unwanted roosters.

 

[HenriettaPizzaNolan]

We plan to get American Bresse birds next season. Living Tradition Homestead has started raising them and showed some butchered. I was impressed by what I saw. They breed well from my research and are good for eggs as well. We will probably just get straight run and butcher the unwanted roosters.

Keep us updated on how it goes! I'm interested in how they do not only for meat, but with eggs.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I’d like to butcher as soon as possible, ideally around 12 or so weeks.

How do your Bielefelders do at 12 weeks? I've never had them but my guess is a lot like most other dual purpose birds. Not much meat at 12 weeks but not bad at 16. I can think of one person on here that butchers at 14 weeks so he can grill them but he got some good stock to start from and then selectively bred his own line for early maturity. You may be looking at something like that. It doesn't take long with careful selective breeding to see a difference in size and early maturity. My goal with that is not to get the one biggest cockerel I can but to get the worst ones in the hatch to decent size. The biggest often becomes my breeder.

I would probably just do 50 or so birds a year for myself.

Using an incubator and a few hatches a year I can easily hatch 40 to 45 chicks a year with one rooster and 6 hens. Your breeding flock doesn't have to be all that big. I typically hatch about 20 chicks in February and may do one more smaller incubator hatch but can usually get the rest with broody hens. I bred my flock so the hens go broody a lot but still have to sometimes use the incubator to get the numbers I want when I want them. One of my issues is managing freezer space. With my garden and orchard freezer space becomes precious when I'm saving berries to make jam or jelly, tomatoes to make sauce, veggies to make soup, and chicken parts to make broth, all of which get canned.

I know it’s not cheaper to raise my own chickens for the most part, but I like being self sufficient as much as possible and knowing where my food comes from. Looking back on the amount I have spent on my egg layers is depressing, each of my eggs is probably worth $5

Many of us understand.

I’ll spend more time exploring the threads on this page. I have a couple breeds in mind, but wanted to see what others would suggest.

My suggestion here is to spend a year experimenting. Once you settle on two or three get some of each and raise them. Ideally that would be together so they have the same experiences and growing conditions but that usually isn't practical. That way you can fill your freezer and see how they do in your conditions and how well they meet your goals. And you can see how practical your goals actually are. I know my goals changed as I raised them.

 

[Sneakyturtle]

How do your Bielefelders do at 12 weeks? I've never had them but my guess is a lot like most other dual purpose birds. Not much meat at 12 weeks but not bad at 16. I can think of one person on here that butchers at 14 weeks so he can grill them but he got some good stock to start from and then selectively bred his own line for early maturity. You may be looking at something like that. It doesn't take long with careful selective breeding to see a difference in size and early maturity. My goal with that is not to get the one biggest cockerel I can but to get the worst ones in the hatch to decent size. The biggest often becomes my breeder.


Using an incubator and a few hatches a year I can easily hatch 40 to 45 chicks a year with one rooster and 6 hens. Your breeding flock doesn't have to be all that big. I typically hatch about 20 chicks in February and may do one more smaller incubator hatch but can usually get the rest with broody hens. I bred my flock so the hens go broody a lot but still have to sometimes use the incubator to get the numbers I want when I want them. One of my issues is managing freezer space. With my garden and orchard freezer space becomes precious when I'm saving berries to make jam or jelly, tomatoes to make sauce, veggies to make soup, and chicken parts to make broth, all of which get canned.


Many of us understand.


My suggestion here is to spend a year experimenting. Once you settle on two or three get some of each and raise them. Ideally that would be together so they have the same experiences and growing conditions but that usually isn't practical. That way you can fill your freezer and see how they do in your conditions and how well they meet your goals. And you can see how practical your goals actually are. I know my goals changed as I raised them.

I have only butchered 2 Bielefelders, but I believe it was around 15 weeks. I’d really like to find something I could do within 12 weeks or so, but nothing I have done so far has been big enough to butcher at 12 weeks. My Bielefelders were probably my biggest chicken at 12 weeks though, followed by my barred rock roosters. But everything I have processed at this point is just extra roosters from eggs I hatched for fun or to get more egg layers, so I haven’t been focusing on meat birds.

I have a nurture right 360 and a hovabator and they both give me food hatch rates. Then I have one silkie that I use as a broody when I only want to hatch a few eggs at a time, and she goes broody a lot.

Freezer space is my biggest issue, I’ll probably have to get another freezer if I’m butchering more than a few birds at a time.

In the spring I’ll get a few different breeds and experiment with them and selectively breeding the fastest growing and see what I learn.

I enjoy experimenting and selectively breeding, so I think it’ll be a fun project.

 

[HollowOfWisps]

My advice would be to experiment. I hatched a mix of duel purpose breeds with the plan to keep the hens and butcher all of the cockerels. I assumed the cockerels would be pretty slow growers and nothing special, but this hatch was just for fun to see what the mixes made. I hatched out a Maran X Faverolle cockerel that shot up in size faster than any other cockerel I've seen that wasn't a broiler type bird. At 3 months he was huge and larger than his father at that age. He has a nice broad meaty barrel of a chest with a thick/stocky compact build that I really like and he has maintained a good even temperament throughout the high hormonal stage. I decided to keep him and use him this spring to see if he passes on his seemingly faster growth and size to his offspring.

 

[MysteryChicken]

I prefer Heritage type birds, over Cornish X. Guess you could say I'm picky about chicken meat, & growth rate.

 

[HollowOfWisps]

I prefer Heritage type birds, over Cornish X. Guess you could say I'm picky about chicken meat, & growth rate.

I agree. I also find something off-putting about the texture from most of the Cornish X chicken at the stores.