Trick Training

[accio! chickens]

I never meant for this post to get into a critique on my handling techniques and has essentially gone off topic. If you have any suggestions for books on trick training feel free to suggest away.

 

[patandchickens]

If you can't touch her hind end without her getting nervous or stepping away, she is NOT REMOTELY ready for trick training. The "tricks" she needs to learn at the moment are to accept contact, stand when asked, and move when asked, *as* asked.

This is usually as much a matter of the person refining their body language as it is the *horse* learning things. Some horses are just much more sensitive than others to "operator error" or imprecision.

If you really want a "trick", work on teaching her to lower her head on cue. Also to bend it around to one side or the other, not grabbing for a treat but holding it there in a relaxed way til you say 'when'. Those will help with the rest of your work.

Gotta get basic communication going first.

Pat

 

[greathorse]

I am going to say this from my own experinence if you are food training your horse and that is the basis for your trust you are in deep deep trouble. There is no more dangerous horse than one that is dependent on treats for human interaction.. That horse will hurt you or others without even trying when nibbling or biting for food. You need to get a good trainer and start over.

I am not saying that a trick training cant be reinforced with food but you simply are asking for big trouble for making that the basis for you trust and understanding with this horse. I dont care if it weighs 300 pounds or 1800 pounds it can hurt you

You dont have control over those hind qtrs and your talking about progress. You need to start there. You need professional help before you get hurt badly

 

[BlackBart]

When I was in Washington I saw a horse that somebody had clicker trained to do tricks.
The new owner had no idea of the clicker training and the poor horse was going thru all these tricks to see if it got the right one.
Then came up the question "How do you untrain a horse from doing tricks?"

 

[accio! chickens]

Quote:
I think you misread what I was trying to say. We are using food as an aid. I offer the treat only after she has let me do what I want with her. We ARE MAKING PROGRESS. I am getting closer. She doesn't kick or threaten, she runs. I DO have professional help and my trainer feels I am doing the right thing. I want IDEAS for trick training, if you read my post again I was asking for ideas and was not at all saying I was going to start training her to do tricks tomorrow. I UNDERSTAND greatly she is no where near being ready, but I need to do research before I am comfortable training her to do some little tricks.

We use the treats as positive reinforcement. Eventually the treats are phased out. The last few days I have been leaving the treats behind and going down and just petting her. I pet her, I get to her neck and just before her back and down her front legs and give her a a very CLEAR "good girl" and leave on a GOOD NOTE.

IMO this IS progress.

 

[accio! chickens]

Quote:
I'm looking at one or two. Bowing and probably lowering her head for a halter/bridle/whatever.

 

[accio! chickens]

Quote:
I'm sorry it sounded like I was going to start right away. Not the case. I realize she has many more days/hours/months left in her for getting to that hind end. I am looking for IDEAS and am not looking to start right away. I agree completely, lowering her head is a BIG trick I am certainly going to be teaching her. It's important for her to learn this as she has a higher headset and I am NOT into fighting with a horse to get a halter or bridle on.

Like I said below, I use the treats as positive reinforcement and they get phased out. Much like with dog training. I fully understand she could easily kill me but I feel like we are getting somewhere in her building some trust. I don't think I ever posted on here what she was like when we got her, but she was very spooky and very wary of humans. Phasing out the treats is simple, we offer the treat a couple times for contact, then we only give her the treat once she has let us gain contact and always with a good girl at the end, and then we leave the treats at the house and give her a good girl. IMO I think I should have used a different word than trust. It's uneasiness because she didn't know me. Her farrier who spent a month training her last year came to do her feet and it was instant. The progress I am seeing now is the kind of relationship she has with her farrier. I am seeing her 'trusting' or rather being comfortable enough with me being there to approach me, but only when I call her and tell her to come to me does she actually approach me fully. I am starting to see less of the whites of her eyes and more of the kind, sweet horse I know is in there.

I was more looking for suggestions on reading material and instruction books I could read until she is ready. I don't want to go into it not knowing what I'm getting into.

 

[greathorse]

you clearly stated that you coax her into letting you pet her with grain. And you still use grain to get to her back. I am telling you that is dangerous business. If it were me I would for sure reconsider any professional that uses food as a means to getting around your mare.

If you want to consider having this horse drop its head on cue and you want to call that a trick that is fine, but you got to get control of that back end before you go anywere else.

 

[patandchickens]

accio! chickens :

I agree completely, lowering her head is a BIG trick I am certainly going to be teaching her. It's important for her to learn this as she has a higher headset and I am NOT into fighting with a horse to get a halter or bridle on.

I was being somewhat, I dunno, sarcastic in referring to that as a trick. It is SOOOOO not a trick. It is basic communication.

And the primary purpose/benefit is sooooooo not "to help you get tack on the horse's head more easily"

If you want reading material and written analyses/suggestions regarding training, which is usually a beneficial thing to pursue, I would HIGHLY recommmend that you focus not on "teaching her things" but on learning how to improve your own body language. From your description, it sounds a lot like this is a rather reactive horse with whom you need to be accurate and clear and not over- or mis-state what you want... which is a very very educational kind of horse to have, but you need to be clear on who is primarily the student

There are various books and videos that will help you to one degree or another with this, if you are really attentive to what you're doing with the horse. And aside from its value in working with a particular 'problem' horse, it is sort of the basic foundation of all horsemanship and thus always worth getting better at *anyhow*

JMHO, having been there and done that and seen this sort of thing an awful lot over the years,

Pat​

 

[greathorse]

There ya go.