Any thoughts on roasted soybeans as a supplement?

[Zenmonkey]

Background information, I've had peafowl (4 blue India, and I know this isn't their forum) for about a year and golden pheasants for almost a year.

Last year I raised the young birds on Purina turkey / gamebird starter, which bills itself as a 30% protein feed. Through the winter they got whatever the local feed store had, typically a 16, 18, or 20% Kalmbach feed. The two closest local feed stores carry that brand.

That's not enough protein for pheasants (or peafowl) as I understand things. The 20% Kalmbach flock maker comes closest among the varieties my local feed store stocks.

They also carry a 22% meat bird feed, though it is a crumble and I prefer pellets. The form isn't a deal breaker though.

Kalmbach's dedicated gamebird grower and breeder mixes are only 18%.

I could try to have them order in a different feed, if anyone wants to offer a suggestion? I know they've got a feather grower mix, but I think it's also on my 20%.

I had them order 150lbs of a 28% turkey / gamebird mix which turned out to be a medicated variety. Now I see Kalmbach has a non medicated flavor, so maybe I just needed to be more specific.

They also carry roasted soybeans. Back when I raised hundreds of pigeons, and the government started encouraging corn to be turned into fuel, feed prices spiked. I switched from bagged feed to a mix made from corn, wheat/ oats / rye, and roasted soybeans. I varied the mix from season to season to hit the carb / protein mix where I wanted it. A local farmer with a grain mixer would mix it for me, quarter ton or so at a time.

So? Does anyone have any thoughts on feeding roasted soybeans as a separate feed stain along side one of the locally available lower protein feeds?

I'm also going to look into having them order me in something different. However asking feed stores to special order feed on a regular basis is somewhat prone to mishap.

 

[007Sean]

Background information, I've had peafowl (4 blue India, and I know this isn't their forum) for about a year and golden pheasants for almost a year.

Last year I raised the young birds on Purina turkey / gamebird starter, which bills itself as a 30% protein feed. Through the winter they got whatever the local feed store had, typically a 16, 18, or 20% Kalmbach feed. The two closest local feed stores carry that brand.

That's not enough protein for pheasants (or peafowl) as I understand things. The 20% Kalmbach flock maker comes closest among the varieties my local feed store stocks.

They also carry a 22% meat bird feed, though it is a crumble and I prefer pellets. The form isn't a deal breaker though.

Kalmbach's dedicated gamebird grower and breeder mixes are only 18%.

I could try to have them order in a different feed, if anyone wants to offer a suggestion? I know they've got a feather grower mix, but I think it's also on my 20%.

I had them order 150lbs of a 28% turkey / gamebird mix which turned out to be a medicated variety. Now I see Kalmbach has a non medicated flavor, so maybe I just needed to be more specific.

They also carry roasted soybeans. Back when I raised hundreds of pigeons, and the government started encouraging corn to be turned into fuel, feed prices spiked. I switched from bagged feed to a mix made from corn, wheat/ oats / rye, and roasted soybeans. I varied the mix from season to season to hit the carb / protein mix where I wanted it. A local farmer with a grain mixer would mix it for me, quarter ton or so at a time.

So? Does anyone have any thoughts on feeding roasted soybeans as a separate feed stain along side one of the locally available lower protein feeds?

I'm also going to look into having them order me in something different. However asking feed stores to special order feed on a regular basis is somewhat prone to mishap.

Most people are rejecting soybean based protein feeds because of the GMO factor.
Roasted soybeans provide a high source of protein but are limited in the essential amino acids like lysine and methionine which are needed to produce muscle and skeletal structures of birds.

Methionine is also important for plumage development. I've been stressing this for years, the feed manufactures have been reducing the amounts of both methionine and lysine used in their feeds.
A lot of breeders and hobbist are switching to either animal base protein feeds or fish meal/bone meal as sources of protein.
Here's a link to an article that you may find interesting!
https://agricsite.com/soybean-meal-for-poultry-feed/

 

[Zenmonkey]

Thank you for that link, @007Sean .

At first I thought you were telling me that soybeans were a bad idea. Maybe you are. Soybeans are relative high in methionine, compared to most plant sources. Comparatively low compared to most animal sources.

That article focuses mostly on roasted soybean meal, and what is available to me is roasted whole soybeans. This was particularly useful to me because it finally beat into my head some answers to things I hadn't understood. I struggled to understand why most sources rated soybeans at 40 to upwards of 50 percent protein, when the bags I got mostly rated to right around 35-36 percent. Also why are whole soybeans more expensive that soybean meal? I got tired of typing "roasted". I'm not going to mention any soybean that isn't roasted, so just assume I mean roasted.

Isn't soybean meal more processed than whole soybeans? Shouldn't I be paying for the extra labor rather than paying to NOT have it?

The meal has had the oil extracted, the meal is a byproduct. The roasted soybeans still have that oil, it is diluting my protein down, and I'm paying for it because they couldn't sell it off earlier. That's why I pay more for a lower protein product. Or that used to be the case. I didn't ask about soybean meal this trip.

I'm not married to the idea of soybeans as a supplement. And I really wish there was a non-GMO option there, but I'm not seeing it locally. I'll look into the other feed options and see if I can reliably get a better feed that doesn't require me tweaking their diet.

I am assuming that for most gamebirds, peafowl, but in particular pheasants, assuming for about 24% protein, plus our minus a point or two, is about right? That seems to be the consensus, but I'd like to know if I'm reading that wrong.

 

[007Sean]

Thank you for that link, @007Sean .

At first I thought you were telling me that soybeans were a bad idea. Maybe you are. Soybeans are relative high in methionine, compared to most plant sources. Comparatively low compared to most animal sources.

That article focuses mostly on roasted soybean meal, and what is available to me is roasted whole soybeans. This was particularly useful to me because it finally beat into my head some answers to things I hadn't understood. I struggled to understand why most sources rated soybeans at 40 to upwards of 50 percent protein, when the bags I got mostly rated to right around 35-36 percent. Also why are whole soybeans more expensive that soybean meal? I got tired of typing "roasted". I'm not going to mention any soybean that isn't roasted, so just assume I mean roasted.

Isn't soybean meal more processed than whole soybeans? Shouldn't I be paying for the extra labor rather than paying to NOT have it?

The meal has had the oil extracted, the meal is a byproduct. The roasted soybeans still have that oil, it is diluting my protein down, and I'm paying for it because they couldn't sell it off earlier. That's why I pay more for a lower protein product. Or that used to be the case. I didn't ask about soybean meal this trip.

I'm not married to the idea of soybeans as a supplement. And I really wish there was a non-GMO option there, but I'm not seeing it locally. I'll look into the other feed options and see if I can reliably get a better feed that doesn't require me tweaking their diet.

I am assuming that for most gamebirds, peafowl, but in particular pheasants, assuming for about 24% protein, plus our minus a point or two, is about right? That seems to be the consensus, but I'd like to know if I'm reading that wrong.

I feed a 24% protein feed from hatch til death. I don't feed a higher % for chick's. 24% is more than adequate protein for the birds. If I was raising for meat type birds, then I would use the higher protein feed....brings them to butcher weight sooner! The big feed manufacturers, ie; Purina, Nutrina don't add enough lysine or methionine to their feeds, this is why I began feeding a mixed seed and fruit feed as well when I was buying commercial feed. I still feed it, eventhough, I have my feed custom milled. You can supplement methionine somewhat by feeding sunflower seeds.

I've notice the price of feeds has gone way up in relation to % protein and in some cases, the more protein is cheaper that the lower protein feeds. Case in point, TSC sells their Dumore chick starter 20% for $23.99 for 50lbs. Their Meat Bird feed is 24% and sells for $19.99 per 50# ...? Idk!