Blue Swedish genetics issues 2020-21?

[Tankueray]

I am no expert on Blue Swedish by any means, but I am a biologist and have some fowl research experience (specifically the amazing hemoglobin of the Bar-Headed Goose), and a pretty decent foundation in husbandry and genetics. I may be suffering from confirmation bias, but recently I've seen threads and heard anecdotal evidence of breed fitness problems in Blue Swedish. It tingles my Spidey sense. So I have questions/requests, maybe just to satisfy my curiosity, or maybe to identify a potential threat to the breed's integrity.

Like any theory, it needs to be validated first, so please help with a comment if you can. The first things to identify/validate are:
A. Is there a problem with the Blue Swedish breed (in the US or elsewhere)?
B. Is that problem widespread or limited to a few genetic lines/hatchery sources?
C. Is this a new problem or possibly something that is considered normal with the Blue Swedish breed?

Action Items/Request for Comments:

1. Everyone: If you've had a significant issue with a Blue Swedish at any time, can you simply post the basic information of that issue? (e.g., Unsexed duckling suffered from upper bill deformity and severely retarded growth, died at 3 weeks, purchased at Tractor Supply, Privett hatchery, February 2021.) (Please note that TSC uses different suppliers in different regions, don't just post Hoover's, post the hatchery only if you know for sure, post the store location if you don't.)
2. Experienced duck keepers: Do you feel like issues with Blue Swedish in particular are outside of the norm compared to: 1.) other breeds, and/or 2.) in the past? (If not, please note whether your experience includes hatchery stock.)
3. Professional breeders/show breeders/Blue Swedish specialists/bird nerds:
   1. Are you aware of any genetics issues, known family lines, etc. that could explain the problem?
   2. Given your experience and any issues reported here or elsewhere, do you think action should be taken to protect the integrity of the breed? (i.e., hobby breed stock is not a threat to pro breed stock.)

Because this is a serious attempt to identify a potential problem, please don't ask for advice in this thread. It's fine to post a new thread and link to it here asking for help when you post your simple report of the issue in response to action item #1. (This makes it easier to zero in on any breed issues and more likely that you can get help with a thread dedicated to just your problem.) Please also refrain from bad-mouthing any particular breeder or hatchery (or chain store), or posting a long story about your displeasure with them here. Again, this is for protecting the breed, and if sources are identified, they will be contacted to request their assistance.

This thread may blow up and we see something right away, or it may take years (at least a few) to confirm anything. Or it could be just me and my overactive imagination, and no one responds. Regardless, thank you all in advance for your time and concern. -Mandy

 

[casportpony]

Following!

 

[Brooke_R]

My Blue Swedish that I got at Atwood’s in Oklahoma has angel wing. He was sick though when we got him because of the conditions of getting him to the store so that could be the reason for the angel wing too.

 

[Tankueray]

My Blue Swedish that I got at Atwood’s in Oklahoma has angel wing. He was sick though when we got him because of the conditions of getting him to the store so that could be the reason for the angel wing too.

I'm assuming that you know by now that angel wing is nutrition related, and can often be "easily" corrected if you can catch it by 8 weeks old. If you didn't know and he's still young, cut back on the protein and make sure he's getting adequate vitamins, including niacin. If it's really bad, you may have to wrap the wings.

Now I'm going to break my own rule and rant about duck food for a minute.

I've noticed that most local "experts" (i.e., feed stores) recommend game bird feed instead of duck feed. I've even argued with the staff at my beloved local feed store about it. I also got onto a Purina rep at a show last weekend about their (well, all brands, really) all-flock not indicating the amount of niacin on the package or online, and the non-answers that are given to customers in the Q&A section of the product pages. He typed that up and sent it to corporate as I was standing there.

Sorry, my point is that it's really hard to find good duck food at your local retailer. Game bird starter (and sometimes plain game bird feed) are too high in protein, and may or may not have niacin. Chick starter (non-medicated) is okay if you can't find anything else, but it doesn't have niacin. I've been lucky to find the 40lb. bags of Purina duck food at one of my local TSCs, but it looked like they were going to stop selling the 40lb bags altogether a few months ago. (Which is why I started looking at alternatives and found that soooo many were recommending game bird feed.)

Ducks grow so insanely fast that their nutrition is extremely important until they are 12 weeks old. By that I mean the amount of protein and niacin (and no junk food carbs). I use this chart and calculator from Metzer. The calculator only if I need to mix feed because I can't find duck feed.
https://www.metzerfarms.com/NutritionalRequirements.cfm
https://www.metzerfarms.com/FeedConversion.cfm

The most important take-away from that chart is that ducks need 22.5% protein for the first two weeks (or 20% for the first four weeks), then cut it back. The problem is that even Nutrena and Purina duck feeds are under that, so....

Personally, I mix 1 5lb bag of Purina 30% game bird starter with 10lbs. of Purina duck food and feed that for the first two weeks, then just Purina or Nutrena (Country Feeds) duck food, until at least week 8. Since I also have chickens, I switch everyone to All Flock (Purina, Nutrena, or DuMor) at 12 weeks, then give oyster shells free choice at week 16.
(My grown chickens prefer all-flock pellets, which is awesome because you know, ducks and crumble are crazy making.)

There isn't really any data indicating that too much niacin is bad, so even if I'm feeding a complete duck food, I also use the B vitamin cattle injection mixed in their water for the first four weeks.

The reason for my particular brand choices is that they all contain pre and pro-biotics (same with chicken feed, but I stick to Nutrena for it), which are very important in maintaining a bird's gut health, and therefore also it's immune system. (Because you all know by now that ducks will eat anything! They need all the support I can give them.)

And as an update to my original post - the sister of my dear departed Blue Swedish developed a small tuft, which makes things a lot more clear genetically. If she was purposely bred with the tuft (crest) genes, then that's incredibly upsetting and a likely suspect in the reduced fitness of her sibling. 4 additional Blue Swedish females that came from Metzer noticeably conform to the standard more than the Privett girl. The boys are still all dumb and awkward, but after watching a few of the brave ones attempt to breed her yesterday, none tried to grab on to her tuft, so at least there's that. (She will not be used for breeding.) The entire barnyard watched the show, literally like they were arranged in stadium seating. It was quite funny, and the only time none of the ducks realized that I was less than 3 feet away from them (just in case, only two of the girls were participating). Turns out I also have a magpie that is quite the floosie!

 

[AngelinaThePekin8]

I have a blue swedish "Rose" that I got from Murdoch's in laramie wyoming.
Rose has a bill deformity her top mandible is turned upwards she is three years old now and is healthy for the most part but she is a little under weight (she looks skinny I am not sure if she is actually under weight or anything).

Before we got Rose and her sister (who is perfectly healthy) we had gotten two blue Swedes from the same store both of those ducklings had wry neck and died the day we brought them home, I am not sure if the wry neck was just the stores fault or not which I am pretty sure it was.
Rose and her sister Duck were replacements for the two that died, the store took the two that died back so they could send it to the lab or whatever they do with the dead ones and we got to "pick out" the replacements. The person grabbing the ducklings didn't and we didn't notice that Rose had a deformed bill until we were at the check out.
I hope this helps, I have a thread about Rose I can post the link to it here if anyone wants it.