Canker help needed please! My beloved rooster needs help!

[CCinVT]

Dear chicken friends, My beloved rooster seems to have a canker. Last summer I was being put through my chicken paces... Mites,worms, bumblefoot... I also hatched too many roosters. It being my first time, and they were so cute I didn't think I had the heart to cull them, and my three boys were happy together...in conclusion I have been trying a rooster flock, and it has good days, and bad days...mostly bad days. Being pro-active this spring I did a poop test, and found worms. I've been worming everybody (hens and roosters) with safegaurd. Today I noticed on my rooster (a no name boy) had what looked like crust on the inside ridge of his beak. When I opened his mouth another small spot. I found it on two at first, and went to get fencing and section them off from the rest. Ive been going back and forth about culling so I thought maybe just these two...looked up canker on here, and then went back outside and started catching roosters. Separating the two I had seen first, then with DH (who has better eyes then me in tow)... Well better check the others so one by one I see they each have signs inside edges of their beaks...now I have 4 no names sectioned off, and So in conclusion I'm down to my original 3 (and on boy who has been on injury vacation in my bathroom) that I want to keep, and will cull the rest... My dear Abraham has what looks like the worst spot to me, 2 other keepers have no signs. It is further back on the roof his mouth, and is raised. Opposed to the others that just look like crust/not right spots. He otherwise seems fine. Is eatting and drinking, and I would not have noticed if I hadn't been checking everyone. So here is where I need feedback! I am thinking... Stop worm treatment, and wait the withdrawl period of all roos I have been hesitating to cull, and do the deed...for the keepers I have thyme extract on hand, and iodine... I have read thyme will work as well as metronidazole, but can't find oral dosing. I have also read that the copper sulfate can work as a treatment if given for 7 days instead of 4.... So my plan is to clean his spot with iodine, and using a qtip apply the thyme oil to the spot. Put oil and acv in his water and order the sulfate. Begin the sulfate treatment asap (I have to order it off Amazon), and also treat my hens, and 3 other keeper rooster as well just in case? They are due for their follow up safegaurd dose in 6 days. And I have probiotics on order (Big ole bird poultry probiotice) which they seem to love and has really helped since last summer, and I bought yogurt today. Compared to pictures I've found online I think I may be catching it Kindda early....I will try to get a picture tonight...has anyone treated canker successfully with the sulfate method or used thyme?
http://www.poultrydvm.com/condition/canker
https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/pet-advice/how-to-treat-canker-in-poultry.html
https://www.meyerhatchery.com/productinfo.a5w?prodID=ACS

 

[Kiki]

O girl I've been wondering how you have been.
I am sorry your are stuck dealing with this nastiness.

You are going to want to use known working medicine and not rely on any herbal treatment for this.
http://www.allivet.com/p-2393-fish-zole-metronidazole.aspx

 

[sourland]

Stress can be a factor in canker outbreaks - such as may be incurred in all rooster flocks, over crowding, extreme temperatures. Some have good results with copper sulfate, but I have always used metronidazole.

 

[featherhead007]

Grrrrr, I'm biting my beak right now! no opportunities for puns or insults lately!

 

[featherhead007]

And I'm out of ice cream!

 

[CCinVT]

O girl I've been wondering how you have been.
I am sorry your are stuck dealing with this nastiness.

You are going to want to use known working medicine and not rely on any herbal treatment for this.
http://www.allivet.com/p-2393-fish-zole-metronidazole.aspx

I thought I was doing Great! haha! I was on top of getting the poop tests done, and No mites, bumblefoot sucess, and the probiotics, and oyster shells my eggs were getting better the girls were getting nice feathers back! I have been going back and forth all day about the fish zole because i am worried i've been over treating them with medicine, and wiping out their systems with the safe gaurd... I was worried about creating super bugs/resistant strains.

Stress can be a factor in canker outbreaks - such as may be incurred in all rooster flocks, over crowding, extreme temperatures. Some have good results with copper sulfate, but I have always used metronidazole.

This rooster is definitely my prized boy, and I am thinking stress played a roll. I've never killed anything that was injured or ill so I was struggling. With Spring in the air, and the girls free ranging the roosters have been going nuts. Our property isn't big enough to put them someplace where they can't see the ladies. my 3 original boys did better by themselves.

@KikisGirls, and @sourland will the netronidazole for sure work compared to the copper sulfate is a maybe?? what about egg with drawl, and my worming. the boys have one more dose of safegaurd, and then my wait period, and one more dose... i'm going off of what I did last summer. And am I correct that I should treat the hens as well just in case?? I will try to check their mouths too, but didn't want to do it after handling the boys. They have been free ranging since spring has arrive though, an the boys have been trying to mate each other. I just want to get everyone healthy, an managed and then I will go back to all natural everything. I have to wait to cull the boys 10 days cause i wormed them right?? one bottle of the fish zole will be enough to treat my whole flock or just the few boys?

 

[Kiki]

As far as worming goes.
You should always treat everyone at the same time.
You only need to dose twice with Safeguard.
Once on day on and once again in 10 or so days.


Nothing is ever "for sure" but I can tell you that if I needed to ever treat for Canker I would be using the Metronidazole.

What are you meaning by waiting 10 days to cull them...for eating them?

 

[CCinVT]

Safeguard dosing:
.23 ml per pound per chicken.
for 5 days straight.

Then repeat one dose again in 10 days.

This is what I have been following from last summer... Everyone finished their day 5 dose today except Abe, and the 6 roosters he is with. So my 17 hens, and other small 5 rooster flock. including my bathroom boy got their day 5 dose this morning... Abraham, and his crew are a day behind because I ran out of safegaurd, and had to go get a new bottle. so his rooster flock is 1 day behind, and their day 5 dose is tomorrow. So I should def. dose Abe, and my two keepers, but I ask about the 10 days because of eating yes. DH would at least prefer they go to a good use, and said he would eat them. so should I still worm the canker crew that will be culled? the boys that is separated from Abe. I have them sectioned off so they aren't sharing food with Abe, and can't get into the coop as of right now. They have a small, but open/ super basic shelter... Abe, and the 2 others are in the coop right now.... I originally started seperating cause i freaked, and saw the two who had it.... i didn't realize when i started checking it would be basically the whole flock. Abe, and his 2 friends would be the ones i'm thinking I would give the fish zole too, and the hens. and just cull the others when it makes sense... That's where i'm at.

 

[Kiki]

That dose is not correct I am sorry.
You only need to treat one day/one dose and then repeat one dose in 10 to 14 days.

 

[CCinVT]

That dose is not correct I am sorry.
You only need to treat one day/one dose and then repeat one dose in 10 to 14 days.

oh geesh. So have I super wormed them?! will they be ok? I guess they survived it last summer...I mean should i still dose them in 10 days? thats for the worm eggs right so I have to... I don't think i have enough safegaurd left to dose everyone again i will have to go get another bottle. It is what I did last summer too, but they were dumping worms last summer. I have only seen two small ones during the whole past week of worming... So do I not need to worry at all about the last dose for Abe tomorrow? I gave 30 birds almost a whole bottle of safegaurd Our tsc was sold out too I had to drive to the next town to buy their last bottle. I would hope they have more in 10 days. We had a crazy mud season this spring. They have been pooping their little brains out. So anyways a week of the poops is why i was worried about giving them more medicine like the fish zole right away...I don't want to over tax their systems... but i also don't want to lose any either... I have my one hen Bernie who is tiny.

As for the canker boys I guess i don't even know at this point if i should keep them separated except i think it's less stress for Abe, and Brian (who would be a keeper, and is currently at the bottom of the flock). They are divided into old boys (my keepers), and young bullies. At this point they all have varied degrees of it. But the young boys are sleeping outside if i leave them in their sectioned off end of the run...