Is soy bad for chickens?

[ManueB]

A tiny (teeny tiny miniscule) amount is rooted in anti-Asian sentiment and now repeated by people because they had heard it before, though they may harbor no such beliefs themselves. The same has happened with many other "ethnic" foods over the centuries, including corn, the staple of the modern chicken feed industry. Lets get that out of the way first, a footnote in history soon to be lost on the page.

A slightly greater amount arises from people who have true food alergies, and believe (often wrongly) that whatever compound in soy that they are alergic too is transfered to the meat or the egg or both.

A somewhat greater amount arises from those who correctly oserve that soy is high in certain phytoestrogens, and from there conclude that phytoestrogen is like estrogen, and causes any number of human cancers. Sometimes, they will cite to some small study for support. The worlds largest human nutrition health study (The California Teacher's Study) found *generally* the opposite. That soy consumption was generally associated with healthier outcomes. However, there are a small number of cancers whose progression is seemingly helped by high phytoestrogen content in the diet - which includes not only soy, but also nuts, grains, and a handful of popular fruits. For the majority, its a case of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing - like suggesting everyone cut out wheat because some people have Celiacs, or refined suger because some suffer adult-onset Diabetes.

The majority, however (and my sense is that this is the vast majority) of those who object to soy do so because the majority of the worldwide crop is "RoundUp Ready" - and they object to GMOs generally, intensive modern farming practice with pesticides generally, and/or Monsanto and their RoundUp product, glyphosate, specifically. For some, its an article of faith immune to rational discourse and debate. For others, its a political stand which holds soy hostage to the end goal of discouraging glypohosate use (and a low value hostage to them, because they don't consume significant soy as part of their regular diet). Others make reasonable effort to avoid most/all modern farming and pesticide practice (and soy avoidance is a small part of that). Still others do it because its been repeated so often, and advertised so effectively in creating a high price niche market segment, that they believe it to be desirous without understanding why.

I'm sure there are other reasons besides, but the above describes almost all the public "voting" on the subject in the marketplace of ideas and product options.

I would add to that for folks in Europe the origin of soy in chicken feed, which is very largely imported from Brazil and one of the crop associated with deforestation.

In some European countries I think the only way of being sure to get soy that does not come from Brazil is to get organic chicken feed. It's not the case here in France as we do grow some soy.

Source through Google translate : https://chaire--bea-vetagro--sup-fr...l=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=fr&_x_tr_pto=wapp

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I would add to that for folks in Europe the origin of soy in chicken feed, which is very largely imported from Brazil and one of the crop associated with deforestation.

In some European countries I think the only way of being sure to get soy that does not come from Brazil is to get organic chicken feed. It's not the case here in France as we do grow some soy.

Source through Google translate : https://chaire--bea-vetagro--sup-fr...l=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=fr&_x_tr_pto=wapp

Thank you for that additional info. Edited my comment above to directly reference your own.

 

[Squawkers]

A tiny (teeny tiny miniscule) amount is rooted in anti-Asian sentiment and now repeated by people because they had heard it before, though they may harbor no such beliefs themselves. The same has happened with many other "ethnic" foods over the centuries, including corn, the staple of the modern chicken feed industry. Lets get that out of the way first, a footnote in history soon to be lost on the page.

A slightly greater amount arises from people who have true food alergies, and believe (often wrongly) that whatever compound in soy that they are alergic too is transfered to the meat or the egg or both.

A somewhat greater amount arises from those who correctly oserve that soy is high in certain phytoestrogens, and from there conclude that phytoestrogen is like estrogen, and causes any number of human cancers. Sometimes, they will cite to some small study for support. The worlds largest human nutrition health study (The California Teacher's Study) found *generally* the opposite. That soy consumption was generally associated with healthier outcomes. However, there are a small number of cancers whose progression is seemingly helped by high phytoestrogen content in the diet - which includes not only soy, but also nuts, grains, and a handful of popular fruits. For the majority, its a case of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing - like suggesting everyone cut out wheat because some people have Celiacs, or refined suger because some suffer adult-onset Diabetes.

The majority, however (and my sense is that this is the vast majority) of those who object to soy do so because the majority of the worldwide crop is "RoundUp Ready" - and they object to GMOs generally, intensive modern farming practice and/or widespread pesticide use generally, and/or Monsanto and their RoundUp product, glyphosate, specifically. [edit] Re: intensive farming practices, see this useful comment below from one of our BYC friends across the pond. In the EU, soy comes primarily from Brazil, where it is closely associated with deforestation. [/edit]

For some, its an article of faith immune to rational discourse and debate. For others, its a political stand which holds soy hostage to the end goal of discouraging glypohosate use (and a low value hostage to them, because they don't consume significant soy as part of their regular diet). Others make reasonable effort to avoid most/all modern farming and pesticide practice (and soy avoidance is a small part of that). Still others do it because its been repeated so often, and advertised so effectively in creating a high price niche market segment, that they believe it to be desirous without understanding why.

I'm sure there are other reasons besides, but the above describes almost all the public "voting" on the subject in the marketplace of ideas and product options.

Thank you!! I really appreciate the time you put into that long answer

 

[Squawkers]

Heard from who/where?

The first time I ever heard of soy-free chicken feed when I was looking at the different options available not long ago. I had never heard of soy-free before, and was a little confused. I googled it and saw that some said it was bad. I was skeptical until a friend said all of their chickens randomly died. It was after changing chicken feed, and they thought it was the soy. I was also a little skeptical then, because just because they might have died from the food change didn’t mean it was the soy. But I figured it wouldn’t hurt to try the soy-free feed after that.

 

[Kiki]

The first time I ever heard of soy-free chicken feed when I was looking at the different options available not long ago. I had never heard of soy-free before, and was a little confused. I googled it and saw that some said it was bad. I was skeptical until a friend said all of their chickens randomly died. It was after changing chicken feed, and they thought it was the soy. I was also a little skeptical then, because just because they might have died from the food change didn’t mean it was the soy. But I figured it wouldn’t hurt to try the soy-free feed after that.View attachment 3870147

 

[MarketGardener]

Soy is GOOD for chickens. Soy is one of the few good plant-based Methionine sources. Methionine is used for all protein formation, and connective tissues particularly. It is critical for developing chicks until they approach adulthood.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Thank you for the skim of unsourced Google summaries. That you would link affirmatively to Garden Betty, whose claims aren't supported by her own resources, or her few posted links to actual authorities, is suggestive (and not in a good way).


"Scary word bad".


You know what else is high in phytic acid? Other legumes, like beans. Several grains, including Wheat and Oats. Seeds, like Sunflower, sesame, linseed, flax, nuts of all sorts. (Also brown rice, numerous veggies, and peas).

Yes, lots of things commonly used to make up diets for poultry are high in phytic acid, because its how plants store phosphorus. And as we all know, chickens essentially can't use phytate phosphorus (that is, phosphorus bound with phytic acid) because they can't process the molecule efficiently. End result? Chickens need a non-phytate phosphorus source in their diet AND their digestive process (unlike ours) isn't freeing up a lot of phytic acid to potentially bond with other minerals. and further, research suggests that the anti-nutritive properties of phytic acid are only of concern in high quantity in already deficient diets.

Look, Phytate is even recommended for human cardiovascular health. Though if your diet is inferior in mineral intake, there are reasons to be cautious. Not really an issue for 1st world countries. only limited concern in 3rd world countries where the alternative is starvation.

Oh, btw, you know what helps neutralize phytic acid? Heat and soaking. The process of making soy meal (used in many feed recipes) reduces phytic acid significantly.

Does soy in diet show up in the meat or eggs?
Says no detectible amount.

 

[skeeeter]

IMO Nobody has ever recommended feeding raw whole soybeans to stock because most all legumes need to be cooked before they are digestable. Even pigeons will get sick on raw beans. That's why feed companies use oilseed cake.. it has already been cooked and is now easily digestable.

 

[Kenya Mwangi]

Thank you!! I really appreciate the time you put into that long answer

Hello The short answer is because corn and soy is bioengineered which would not be found naturaly in nature. If you mess with nature it will mess with you back with food sensitiviites and allergies and chronic diseases. Bioengineered foods get lots of chemicals sprayed on them too. I read today that's why they are bad. Some people think food sensitivites are not even food sensitivities, but instead they are your body reacting to the chemicals in the food from being sprayed. I think one man sued roundup and won because it gave him cancer. For me if something causes cancer, I don't want even a trace amount of it on my food.

 

[saysfaa]

I'm mildly anti-soy for my chickens for none of the above reasons. My objection is how ubiquitous soy has become in the food supply and in agriculture. I think moderation and variety are better long term strategies for a healthy ecosystems at most scales that "ecosystem"
can mean.

By "mildly" I mean I feed my chickens primarily standard corn/soy based feeds even though I would rather not. I haven't found a better alternative yet - not one that is workable for my situation anyway.