It's like Bumblefoot ,but with no scab...what is it ?

[MadisonAdam]

 

[MadisonAdam]

My biggest girl Sasha, Sapphire Gem , 1 year old, been soaking in epsom salts 20 min a day for a week,and only seems to be getting worse. Theres no scab to remove to pull the kernel out,doesnt even seem there is a kernel,at least not below...I'm almost wondering since it's different if i ought to try to cut it from the top to pop it,but not wanting to cut into my girl. It doesn't affect her mobility or anything else in any way,she has never appeared to notice it,doesnt seem to bother her

 

[Razzlefrazzle]

Bumblefoot doesn't always have a scab. I can see she had some sort of cut on the bottom of her foot which may have closed up around some dirt/debris that is now causing the inflammation and infection between her toes. At least that is my best guess. Unfortunately without a scab it's hard to know where it's best to get the infection out. I would try cutting into the top, but be prepared that you may have to do a lot of digging and squeezing to find the infection which is usually a hard yellowish mass. Some people use sugardine (sugar and iodine paste) as a drawing salve to help draw out the infection, but your case looks pretty advanced/serious and I'd be concerned the infection could spread to her bone if not dealt with quickly. Here is a site you might find helpful that walks you through bumblefoot surgery: https://the-chicken-chick.com/bumblefoot-causes-treatment-warning/

 

[coach723]

I agree. It could have originally been a fairly minor injury, but the bacteria that gets in is the issue. It even could be a splinter or thorn. Since the bottom looks pretty healed, I also would recommend lancing from the top. Have some tweezers, chlorhexidine solution, some plain water or sterile saline, an oral syringe is useful for flushing, some paper towels. Some gauze or telfa pads, vet wrap or co wrap. Triple antibiotic ointement, or sugardine. When you clean it out, take your time and get as much gunk out as possible. Flush it well. If you think there is still any gunk in there then I would pack it with the sugardine rather than the ointment, and repack it daily and rebandage. The sugardine will help prevent the bacteria from growing and help pull out the infection, it's slow but it works. Pictures post procedure are welcome. I did a similar foot about a month ago, it took a week of sugardine and a couple more weeks to heal up. If you lay her on her back wrapped in a towel, they tend to be more relaxed, you can lay a small cloth or towel over her face, unless you have some one to hold her. Even then, it's often easier if they are on their backs.

 

[MadisonAdam]

I agree. It could have originally been a fairly minor injury, but the bacteria that gets in is the issue. It even could be a splinter or thorn. Since the bottom looks pretty healed, I also would recommend lancing from the top. Have some tweezers, chlorhexidine solution, some plain water or sterile saline, an oral syringe is useful for flushing, some paper towels. Some gauze or telfa pads, vet wrap or co wrap. Triple antibiotic ointement, or sugardine. When you clean it out, take your time and get as much gunk out as possible. Flush it well. If you think there is still any gunk in there then I would pack it with the sugardine rather than the ointment, and repack it daily and rebandage. The sugardine will help prevent the bacteria from growing and help pull out the infection, it's slow but it works. Pictures post procedure are welcome. I did a similar foot about a month ago, it took a week of sugardine and a couple more weeks to heal up. If you lay her on her back wrapped in a towel, they tend to be more relaxed, you can lay a small cloth or towel over her face, unless you have some one to hold her. Even then, it's often easier if they are on their backs.

Thank you both. I used a sterile Xacto knife after soaking her foot in epsom salts ,and cut a large cross shape,tried to do smaller cut at first but couldnt get in there enough,so ended up being over a half inch across each cut, there was no kernel,or solidified mass ,just liquid yellow puss that shot out 3 feet when i pressed ,i got out all i could until it was an empty cavity,and flushed /irrigated it with syringe full of hydrogen peroxide,twice,then dabbed paper towel and used qu-tip smothered with triple antibiotic ointment trying to pack the empty cavity with it,then a little gauze covered with narrow vet wrap strips and tape to help it stay on. Guess i'll give it 48 hours then reclean it,re flush it,repack with triple antibiotic ointment and rewrap. She seems to be doing fine,but she was doing fine before i cut into her as well,running and jumping with no problem,the bandage slows her down now. I'm more concerned now that maybe i shouldnt have cut it open since there was no kernel or mass to remove,thinking maybe it would have popped on it's own,she is my favourite of the girls that still lay,so hopefully i didn't screw her up.

 

[coach723]

All that needed to be removed, you did the right thing. Hopefully it will heal up well, but sometimes you do have to repeat cleanings. If it continues to regenerate, then the sugardine might be helpful, it has worked well for me on some very stubborn ones.
Just mix a little plain, white sugar, a tablespoon is plenty, with a few drops of betadine/provodone iodine, it should be the consistency of gritty peanut butter. Pack the hole with that and wrap to hold it in. Reapply that daily until it is no longer generating pus.

 

[MadisonAdam]

All that needed to be removed, you did the right thing. Hopefully it will heal up well, but sometimes you do have to repeat cleanings. If it continues to regenerate, then the sugardine might be helpful, it has worked well for me on some very stubborn ones.
Just mix a little plain, white sugar, a tablespoon is plenty, with a few drops of betadine/provodone iodine, it should be the consistency of gritty peanut butter. Pack the hole with that and wrap to hold it in. Reapply that daily until it is no longer generating pus.

Thanks Coach, I appreciate that. The only Iodine i have is regular Iodine,labeled "Iodine gentle wound spray for horses and cows " i use it for goats...its a peroxide sized bottle with a spray/squirt pump on it . Not sure if that will work or not. I was hoping i could leave the wrap on for 48 hours each time because i live alone and only have access to another person available once every couple of days,and it helps greatly if i have someone to hold the chicken in a towel burrito. The sugardyne is better than flushing with peroxide then packing with antibiotic ointment ? Not arguing with you,just asking. I also have " wound coat spray " by Farnam ,not sure if it rates highly in this application or not. If the SugarDyne is better than these,then i'll try to find some of the special Iodine you mentioned.

 

[coach723]

Without seeing the label, I don't know if what you have is the right thing. You can get it at any pharmacy, walmart, etc. Peroxide is not necessarily the best thing to use repeatedly, it can inhibit healing. If you need to flush again then chlorhexidine (hibiclens), sterile saline, or plain, mild soapy water would be better. If you are only able to do it every other day, then do that, it may just take a little longer. The ointment may work also, it's hard to predict, every foot is different. I use the ointment unless it's one that just keeps regenerating pus over and over, then I switch to the sugardine. I've had very good results with it.

 

[MadisonAdam]

Without seeing the label, I don't know if what you have is the right thing. You can get it at any pharmacy, walmart, etc. Peroxide is not necessarily the best thing to use repeatedly, it can inhibit healing. If you need to flush again then chlorhexidine (hibiclens), sterile saline, or plain, mild soapy water would be better. If you are only able to do it every other day, then do that, it may just take a little longer. The ointment may work also, it's hard to predict, every foot is different. I use the ointment unless it's one that just keeps regenerating pus over and over, then I switch to the sugardine. I've had very good results with it.

Thank you Coach

 

[MadisonAdam]

Thank you Coach

Well it's been a week now since cutting the top of her foot open, i switched from peroxide to the Iodine wound spray followed up by the Wound Kote spray,followed up by packing lots of triple antibiotic ointment,and the X hole i made never closed back up,just turned black and seemed dried up,but today when repacking i noticed the big bubble is back,even though its open at the top,squeezing does nothing. Since the opening still hasnt closed/healed shut,i definitely don't want to make another cut...so..since Walmart is an hour and a half drive away round trip ,i think tommorow i'll use my animal iodine wound ,surgical spray( instead of the providone Iodine that i don't have ) mixed with the sugar as you suggested instead of the triple antibiotic ointment...it definitely seems to need some sort of drawing salve on it. I wish i would have known it wasn't Bumblefoot before i cut into it. I'd have made a much smaller cut.