Looking for Passover feed recipe for Layers

[U_Stormcrow]

When I wasn't able to get feed during the pandemic, I used a human tracker (maybe my fitness pal? Lol) and changed my recipe until the macros looked similar to the bagged food. I do not have a specific recipe though. But again, I feel like you are doing so many other things that for the short duration of Pesach they will be totally happy and healthy!

I'm linking a conversation thread from several years ago- I haven't read all of the 8 pages but maybe there's something helpful in here as well!

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/what-to-feed-chickens-during-pesach-passover.1163179/

There is no "feed recipe" in that post, I was active in it at the time.

As I said there, and will repeat now, I'm not going to tell anyone what is and isn't allowed, practice varies between Jewish traditions, not a mine field I'm willing to step into.

That said, I'm going to offer some general advice to @farmdreamer18 based on studies and experience.

1) Particularly for adult birds, 8 days of questionable nutrition is not going to have long term health consequences. 8 days of really horrific nutrition might, but we're not going to do anything that unhealthy.

2) Given CHOICES, chickens can with some success, self regulate their food intakes to match their nutritional needs. They might not initially (same reason we human types frequently reach for ice cream, Doritos, various malt beverages when there are other, healthier, foods available), but over time, they will balance things out.

3) Would you happen to have one of those divided serving trays??? i.e. this...

We are going to start filling those sections.

A) I understand, for most traditions, corn is permissible during Passover. Corn is a good choice, it makes up the bulk of many modern feeds. Its an energy source, has few anti-nutritive properties, its cheap. Its also low nutritional value, but not 0 nutritional value. Fine to put some out for your birds. Throw some in 2 sections (only one - your largest - if you don't have a lot of sections).

B) You need a dense animal (or animal like) protein source. Not only will it help you meet crude protein targets, but its almost your only hope of hitting the desired Methionine levels, which is low in most plants. Soy meal is the best plant source. You've said you don't use soy in your house. That's fine. Fish meal is an even better source. Throw some in a section.

C) We need variety. Normally you would want some grains (energy, certain vitamins, tend to be relatively high in Lysine for their low protein counts) - but those are out for you. We are using corn as a partial substitute. You also want a legume (soy, typically - lots of reasons irrelevant here). This is where you will throw some dried peas, chickpeas, beans, or peas into a section. Best choices for you would be Lentils, Chickpeas, or Cowpeas [black eyed peas, purple hulled peas, cream peas, crowder peas, clay peas] All have relatively low tannins, goods sources of Lysine (remember, corn is low), Threonine. Cowpea Methionine numbers are good, others aren' terrible, and their Tryp numbers are acceptable. Unfortunately, high fiber, which isn't a great thing for chickens.

D) We still need variety. This is where you would add a seed/seeds. Many are nutritionally dense (and also high fat), but still relatively low protein (but better than grains). Your Legumes, and more importantly, your fish meal, is compensating for shortages here. Personally, I'd avoid Flax. I know its pushed as a "super food" but mostly, its super expensive. That said, its comparable to hemp seed, gram seed, and sesame seeds - and they are even more expensive. BOSS (Black Oil Sunflower Seed), or a "wild bird mix" of Black Oil Sunflower, various millets, and likely corn will do here.

E) throw your egg shells, oyster shells, preferred calcium source into a section.

Still have sections to fill?

Skim milk, yogurt, or kefir can go in one. Good animal proteins, some vitamins.

If you want (and your faith allows) the use of enriched rice during this time? Yep, throw some in a section. Its mostly a corn alternative, the "enriched" part is the important part. No need to cook it first.

No need for your meal worms or "omega mix" - both are high fat sources and there is already lots of energy in the above. You can if you want to, but there is no need for it. If you have to choose one, go with the "Omega" mix.

If you have kitchen scraps? Yep, they can have that too.

The idea here is not to make a balanced diet, its to ensure the chicken have enough options that they can sort of balance the diet themselves. You are offering a buffet, and getting them thru this period without seriously getting their diet out of balance.

Now, the hard part. They need to choose for themselves and self regulate. That may mean that they eat lots of some options, and little of others. Let them do it.

and that's best advice i can offer.

 

[KyCoop]

Do you need the eggs? Would having a neighbor or friend collect them and take them for the week be counted as you not benefitting? Like you could still feed them their normal food but not be taking eggs from them?

 

[farmdreamer18]

Do you need the eggs? Would having a neighbor or friend collect them and take them for the week be counted as you not benefitting? Like you could still feed them their normal food but not be taking eggs from them?

Ya that still counts if they are on my premises. I'm fine without the eggs. The feed is the issue. There is actually a loophole to temporarily sell the chickens to a non jew and buy them back after the holiday.
The problem with that is:
1. I would have to relocate the chickens which would cause them stress.
2. I only know 1 person with chickens and they are also Jewish. I live in a city (legal here) surrounded by towns where it is illegal to own chickens.
But good thinking on your part to help me figure this out.

 

[farmdreamer18]

There is no "feed recipe" in that post, I was active in it at the time.

As I said there, and will repeat now, I'm not going to tell anyone what is and isn't allowed, practice varies between Jewish traditions, not a mine field I'm willing to step into.

That said, I'm going to offer some general advice to @farmdreamer18 based on studies and experience.

1) Particularly for adult birds, 8 days of questionable nutrition is not going to have long term health consequences. 8 days of really horrific nutrition might, but we're not going to do anything that unhealthy.

2) Given CHOICES, chickens can with some success, self regulate their food intakes to match their nutritional needs. They might not initially (same reason we human types frequently reach for ice cream, Doritos, various malt beverages when there are other, healthier, foods available), but over time, they will balance things out.

3) Would you happen to have one of those divided serving trays??? i.e. this...
View attachment 4070367 We are going to start filling those sections.

A) I understand, for most traditions, corn is permissible during Passover. Corn is a good choice, it makes up the bulk of many modern feeds. Its an energy source, has few anti-nutritive properties, its cheap. Its also low nutritional value, but not 0 nutritional value. Fine to put some out for your birds. Throw some in 2 sections (only one - your largest - if you don't have a lot of sections).

B) You need a dense animal (or animal like) protein source. Not only will it help you meet crude protein targets, but its almost your only hope of hitting the desired Methionine levels, which is low in most plants. Soy meal is the best plant source. You've said you don't use soy in your house. That's fine. Fish meal is an even better source. Throw some in a section.

C) We need variety. Normally you would want some grains (energy, certain vitamins, tend to be relatively high in Lysine for their low protein counts) - but those are out for you. We are using corn as a partial substitute. You also want a legume (soy, typically - lots of reasons irrelevant here). This is where you will throw some dried peas, chickpeas, beans, or peas into a section. Best choices for you would be Lentils, Chickpeas, or Cowpeas [black eyed peas, purple hulled peas, cream peas, crowder peas, clay peas] All have relatively low tannins, goods sources of Lysine (remember, corn is low), Threonine. Cowpea Methionine numbers are good, others aren' terrible, and their Tryp numbers are acceptable. Unfortunately, high fiber, which isn't a great thing for chickens.

D) We still need variety. This is where you would add a seed/seeds. Many are nutritionally dense (and also high fat), but still relatively low protein (but better than grains). Your Legumes, and more importantly, your fish meal, is compensating for shortages here. Personally, I'd avoid Flax. I know its pushed as a "super food" but mostly, its super expensive. That said, its comparable to hemp seed, gram seed, and sesame seeds - and they are even more expensive. BOSS (Black Oil Sunflower Seed), or a "wild bird mix" of Black Oil Sunflower, various millets, and likely corn will do here.

E) throw your egg shells, oyster shells, preferred calcium source into a section.

Still have sections to fill?

Skim milk, yogurt, or kefir can go in one. Good animal proteins, some vitamins.

If you want (and your faith allows) the use of enriched rice during this time? Yep, throw some in a section. Its mostly a corn alternative, the "enriched" part is the important part. No need to cook it first.

No need for your meal worms or "omega mix" - both are high fat sources and there is already lots of energy in the above. You can if you want to, but there is no need for it. If you have to choose one, go with the "Omega" mix.

If you have kitchen scraps? Yep, they can have that too.

The idea here is not to make a balanced diet, its to ensure the chicken have enough options that they can sort of balance the diet themselves. You are offering a buffet, and getting them thru this period without seriously getting their diet out of balance.

Now, the hard part. They need to choose for themselves and self regulate. That may mean that they eat lots of some options, and little of others. Let them do it.

and that's best advice i can offer.

There is no "feed recipe" in that post, I was active in it at the time.

As I said there, and will repeat now, I'm not going to tell anyone what is and isn't allowed, practice varies between Jewish traditions, not a mine field I'm willing to step into.

That said, I'm going to offer some general advice to @farmdreamer18 based on studies and experience.

1) Particularly for adult birds, 8 days of questionable nutrition is not going to have long term health consequences. 8 days of really horrific nutrition might, but we're not going to do anything that unhealthy.

2) Given CHOICES, chickens can with some success, self regulate their food intakes to match their nutritional needs. They might not initially (same reason we human types frequently reach for ice cream, Doritos, various malt beverages when there are other, healthier, foods available), but over time, they will balance things out.

3) Would you happen to have one of those divided serving trays??? i.e. this...
View attachment 4070367 We are going to start filling those sections.

A) I understand, for most traditions, corn is permissible during Passover. Corn is a good choice, it makes up the bulk of many modern feeds. Its an energy source, has few anti-nutritive properties, its cheap. Its also low nutritional value, but not 0 nutritional value. Fine to put some out for your birds. Throw some in 2 sections (only one - your largest - if you don't have a lot of sections).

B) You need a dense animal (or animal like) protein source. Not only will it help you meet crude protein targets, but its almost your only hope of hitting the desired Methionine levels, which is low in most plants. Soy meal is the best plant source. You've said you don't use soy in your house. That's fine. Fish meal is an even better source. Throw some in a section.

C) We need variety. Normally you would want some grains (energy, certain vitamins, tend to be relatively high in Lysine for their low protein counts) - but those are out for you. We are using corn as a partial substitute. You also want a legume (soy, typically - lots of reasons irrelevant here). This is where you will throw some dried peas, chickpeas, beans, or peas into a section. Best choices for you would be Lentils, Chickpeas, or Cowpeas [black eyed peas, purple hulled peas, cream peas, crowder peas, clay peas] All have relatively low tannins, goods sources of Lysine (remember, corn is low), Threonine. Cowpea Methionine numbers are good, others aren' terrible, and their Tryp numbers are acceptable. Unfortunately, high fiber, which isn't a great thing for chickens.

D) We still need variety. This is where you would add a seed/seeds. Many are nutritionally dense (and also high fat), but still relatively low protein (but better than grains). Your Legumes, and more importantly, your fish meal, is compensating for shortages here. Personally, I'd avoid Flax. I know its pushed as a "super food" but mostly, its super expensive. That said, its comparable to hemp seed, gram seed, and sesame seeds - and they are even more expensive. BOSS (Black Oil Sunflower Seed), or a "wild bird mix" of Black Oil Sunflower, various millets, and likely corn will do here.

E) throw your egg shells, oyster shells, preferred calcium source into a section.

Still have sections to fill?

Skim milk, yogurt, or kefir can go in one. Good animal proteins, some vitamins.

If you want (and your faith allows) the use of enriched rice during this time? Yep, throw some in a section. Its mostly a corn alternative, the "enriched" part is the important part. No need to cook it first.

No need for your meal worms or "omega mix" - both are high fat sources and there is already lots of energy in the above. You can if you want to, but there is no need for it. If you have to choose one, go with the "Omega" mix.

If you have kitchen scraps? Yep, they can have that too.

The idea here is not to make a balanced diet, its to ensure the chicken have enough options that they can sort of balance the diet themselves. You are offering a buffet, and getting them thru this period without seriously getting their diet out of balance.

Now, the hard part. They need to choose for themselves and self regulate. That may mean that they eat lots of some options, and little of others. Let them do it.

and that's best advice i can offer.

Wow! Thank you for taking the time to write this out. Makes a lot of sense, after all that ice cream one wants a glass of water and an apple. LOL!
Some info.. legumes ie, lentils, beans, peas, and rice are a grey area. Some sects of Judaism completely eat them over passover, some do not eat them but they may derive benefit from them, as is the case here.
I have a few questions for you.
1. Should I put the dried corn in a blender to chop it up a bit? the corn in their current feed looks chopped up.
2. I mentioned earlier that I give them sprouted lentils with their lunch sometimes. Should this be a whole section daily? I remember reading somewhere that raw lentils are hard for them to digest (they get so excited about the sprouted ones).
3. Should the millet be sprouted as well?
4. Should I mix egg shells with their crushed oyster shells?
5. Most importantly, am I ditching the feeder container for a week and giving them this buffet tray instead? Shouldn't I raise it up a bit so they don't walk and poop in it? Or was this just an example for portions and I should put their food in the feeder?

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Whole dried corn is fine. Sprouted is fine. Sprouted (millet) also fine. Calcium sources can be seperate if desired.

We are using the buffet tray so they can self select their menu, rather than blending it all together and offering in a feeder. That way, they can adjust ratios of ingredient intake to their own needs. If you don't have a beffet tray type serving dish, indivdual shallow tupperware containers work fine too. In eithe rcase, expect them to spill/scatter some. The large individual ingredient sizes should hopefully reduce how much they ignore once its out of the trays

 

[Love Ducklings]

You are over thinking this. It's just one week. I just mix boss with corn and put out oyster shells. They also get all the matza crumbs and leftover fish and meat from everyone's plate. It's the time of year that they're having too much fun searching for bugs, to be worried about a little change in feed

 

[U_Stormcrow]

You are over thinking this. It's just one week. I just mix boss with corn and put out oyster shells. They also get all the matza crumbs and leftover fish and meat from everyone's plate. It's the time of year that they're having too much fun searching for bugs, to be worried about a little change in feed

^ also an approach.

That was my #1

1) Particularly for adult birds, 8 days of questionable nutrition is not going to have long term health consequences. 8 days of really horrific nutrition might, but we're not going to do anything that unhealthy.

Though its important to remember that cage-kept birds in small backyard enclosures (typical of many backyard keepers, largely for reasons of building codes and space constraints) have limited, variable, and unreliable amounts of bugs available.

 

[Love Ducklings]

Oh, and they love having all the leftover romaine lettuce. Not sure where you live, but the kosher groceries usually have a lot of extra then.

 

[ChaosMom]

The hens are our pets. Within the orthodox way of practicing Judaism I am not allowed to eat, derive benefit, or have in my possession certain grains (wheat, barley, spelt, rye, oats) during the week of passover. So If I would have their feed and give that to them, that would be having possession and deriving benefit because my hens make me happy and they also make eggs, which I would also benefit from.

Isn’t there rabbinical guidance for this situation? Pets, livestock, etc. (Also curious; not sarcastic)

 

[farmdreamer18]

Whole dried corn is fine. Sprouted is fine. Sprouted (millet) also fine. Calcium sources can be seperate if desired.

We are using the buffet tray so they can self select their menu, rather than blending it all together and offering in a feeder. That way, they can adjust ratios of ingredient intake to their own needs. If you don't have a beffet tray type serving dish, indivdual shallow tupperware containers work fine too. In eithe rcase, expect them to spill/scatter some. The large individual ingredient sizes should hopefully reduce how much they ignore once its out of the trays

Got it! I will do this. Thank you so much for your help with this!