Managing breeds?

[Ridgerunner]

Sorry, one of the problems I meant is that I won’t have several generations very quickly if I minimize the number of eggs that a hen is allowed to hatch. I live in town so I don’t have space for an extra dozen chicks on top of the 15 that I ordered. So my idea of a sustainable flock is a very slow replacement, if that makes sense.

Whether you keep one or twelve, that's a generation.

Our situations are different. I have over 2,000 square feet of room outside of the coop. I have a 8x12 feet coop and two 4x8 shelters where they can sleep. My main flock is 1 rooster and 6 to 8 hens but I hatch out 40 to 45 chicks a year. Typically I'll add 3 replacement pullets each year. Things can happen through the year where I lose some. Often that is me eating one because she did not meet my goals as far as behaviors or production. My genetic diversity would stay higher if I had more hens (more randomness) but this is how I choose to raise them. We each have to find our own way.

I appreciate the advice about allowing a couple of eggs, I hadn’t considered a single chick trying to survive in an existing flock.

Not all eggs hatch. I've had hatches here 100% of the eggs hatched. I had one where 0 eggs hatched, due to an egg breaking under a broody hen and fouling the others. My suggestion is to determine the maximum number of chicks you can manage and set that many eggs. If they all hatch, you can manage. If some don't hatch, well, hopefully it is enough.

They can often become violent and tend to attack children first.

I respect Mrs. K and her experiences but this is one of the few places we disagree. Cockerels and roosters can become human aggressive, so can hens for that matter. Kids are at more risk when this happens because they are less able to defend themselves. I do not deny that life has risks. You may be T-boned the next time you drive to the grocery when someone runs a stop sign. That happened to my sister-in-law a few decades back and she is still suffering from it. She did not stop driving to the grocery store because of that.

Not all and in my experience not even most cockerels or roosters become human aggressive. Some are that way when hatched, some are made that way by our interactions. Cockerels and roosters have an instinct to protect their flock. Broody hens have an instinct to protect their chicks. If we threaten the flock or the chicks we are much more likely to be attacked than otherwise. This does not mean they will always attack if we appear threatening. They will not always. This does not mean they won't attack unprovoked, some will. But the less your kids interact with your flock the smaller their chance of suffering an attack.

I don't see how letting your kids get a year older changes things significantly. I don't see how much you can learn about rooster behavior with an all-hen flock, especially when they are fairly immature much of their first year.

To me, the only reason you need a rooster is if you want fertile eggs. Everything else is just personal choice. My general recommendation is to keep as few males as you can and still meet your goals. That's not because you are guaranteed problems with more males, just that the more you have the more likely you are to have issues.

There are two general ways to get a rooster. There are variations on both of these. Some people have very strong feelings as to why their specific way is best but the reality is that we use all these methods. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't. You can hatch eggs or get baby chicks and raise them with your flock. That's the way I do it because it fits my other goals. You can bring in a mature rooster once your girls are laying. That generally works well but some of us are concerned with biosecurity issues. Typically if your male is mature and the girls are laying, he mates with a couple when first introduced and the flock is his. Very peaceful. But occasionally that does not work, it can become violent. You do not get guarantees with chickens and their behaviors.

Good luck!

 

[Mrs. K]

While I agree with Ridgerunner in that you won't get rooster experience with an all hen flock, you will get chicken experience. If you have never been around chickens, getting some experience is valuable.

I don't see a need for a rooster, unless you are wanting to hatch. And one should not hatch pullet eggs, so there is not an immediate need for a rooster. Flock mate roosters seldom turn out, especially in small backyard flocks.

As for kids - they do tend to be attacked first, then women. This forum is filled with posts where the darling became the nightmare in an instant. Which is probably not true, but inexperienced people often do not pick up on the signals that a rooster is becoming aggressive.

Many people start this hobby as something to do with their kids, they have a single backyard that will be shared with those kids. Not a large coop/ large run. Often times what seems like a lot of space with chicks, rapidly becomes no where near enough space for full grown birds. IMO roosters take more space than hens.

People have years to work into this wonderful hobby, no need to do it all at once.

Mrs K

Our situations are different. I have over 2,000 square feet of room outside of the coop. I have a 8x12 feet coop and two 4x8 shelters where they can sleep.

 

[rjl]

How small are your children? Unfortunately cockerels and roosters are not like puppies and cats. They can often become violent and tend to attack children first. A small child can take the attack to the head or face. Roosters have ruined the whole chicken experience for a lot of people.

You have years to do this hobby, I would suggest starting with an all hen flock. Get some experience, test out your coop/run. Next year add a rooster, roosters are easy to get and cheap. Then start playing with hatching.

You should not hatch pullet eggs, they are smaller in the beginning, and not big enough to produce a viable chick. If you buy chicks now, you are 5-6 months away from laying, add 3 months to that to get eggs big enough to hatch, and you are way down in the winter if you are in the northern hemisphere. Not need for a rooster till next spring.

Mrs K

My oldest is 5 and my youngest is 4 months. I’m not purposely adding a rooster but there’s a chance that I’ll get one with my order so I’m trying to figure out if it’s worth keeping around to sustain my flock long term or if we should just cull him.

 

[rjl]

Since you mentioned foraging ability as one of your main goals, I’m assuming that you’re looking to free range your birds.

Roosters in free range groups are not an absolute must, but I have found them to be extremely helpful. All-female free range groups can be successful, but it’s tricky. I’ve only every had one free range group be all females, and while it did have more losses, it was successful.

Key part of said success I contribute to the age differences within the group; the head hen(s) were much older, the middle ranking females were young hens, and the low ranking ones were just pullets. In this semi-generational system, the matriarchs of the group were mature enough to assume most of the rooster’s duties, something that I’ve yet to see happening with immature pullets.

Depending on the predator load in your area, both the need for a rooster and the rate at which you can let your hens hatch out chicks increases or decreases. If your property gets visited by predators quite frequently, then you can assume that some of your birds will get predated.

Over the generations, with natural brooding and predation, your chickens will reach a point of being good foragers, and survivors. Letting one hen every breeding season hatch out a generous clutch sounds about right. From each generation, both you and the environment will choose which birds will pass on their genes.

Letting a hen sit on a single egg is seldom successful, since the fertility, viability, and successful hatching are not guaranteed. On top of that, the chick will need to survive in a free range setting, especially when mum decides to leave, which is a very dangerous period for free ranging juveniles

Thank you! That is a lot of great information for me to consider as we move along in this process.

 

[rjl]

Whether you keep one or twelve, that's a generation.

Our situations are different. I have over 2,000 square feet of room outside of the coop. I have a 8x12 feet coop and two 4x8 shelters where they can sleep. My main flock is 1 rooster and 6 to 8 hens but I hatch out 40 to 45 chicks a year. Typically I'll add 3 replacement pullets each year. Things can happen through the year where I lose some. Often that is me eating one because she did not meet my goals as far as behaviors or production. My genetic diversity would stay higher if I had more hens (more randomness) but this is how I choose to raise them. We each have to find our own way.


Not all eggs hatch. I've had hatches here 100% of the eggs hatched. I had one where 0 eggs hatched, due to an egg breaking under a broody hen and fouling the others. My suggestion is to determine the maximum number of chicks you can manage and set that many eggs. If they all hatch, you can manage. If some don't hatch, well, hopefully it is enough.


I respect Mrs. K and her experiences but this is one of the few places we disagree. Cockerels and roosters can become human aggressive, so can hens for that matter. Kids are at more risk when this happens because they are less able to defend themselves. I do not deny that life has risks. You may be T-boned the next time you drive to the grocery when someone runs a stop sign. That happened to my sister-in-law a few decades back and she is still suffering from it. She did not stop driving to the grocery store because of that.

Not all and in my experience not even most cockerels or roosters become human aggressive. Some are that way when hatched, some are made that way by our interactions. Cockerels and roosters have an instinct to protect their flock. Broody hens have an instinct to protect their chicks. If we threaten the flock or the chicks we are much more likely to be attacked than otherwise. This does not mean they will always attack if we appear threatening. They will not always. This does not mean they won't attack unprovoked, some will. But the less your kids interact with your flock the smaller their chance of suffering an attack.

I don't see how letting your kids get a year older changes things significantly. I don't see how much you can learn about rooster behavior with an all-hen flock, especially when they are fairly immature much of their first year.

To me, the only reason you need a rooster is if you want fertile eggs. Everything else is just personal choice. My general recommendation is to keep as few males as you can and still meet your goals. That's not because you are guaranteed problems with more males, just that the more you have the more likely you are to have issues.

There are two general ways to get a rooster. There are variations on both of these. Some people have very strong feelings as to why their specific way is best but the reality is that we use all these methods. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't. You can hatch eggs or get baby chicks and raise them with your flock. That's the way I do it because it fits my other goals. You can bring in a mature rooster once your girls are laying. That generally works well but some of us are concerned with biosecurity issues. Typically if your male is mature and the girls are laying, he mates with a couple when first introduced and the flock is his. Very peaceful. But occasionally that does not work, it can become violent. You do not get guarantees with chickens and their behaviors.

Good luck!

I appreciate all the thoughts, thank you! I have some experience with chicks and some experience with hens but have never done the full raising of chicks myself and never had to deal with a rooster. If I end up with a male, I will likely keep him and see how things go. I don’t mind having to cull him later if things aren’t working well.

 

[Mrs. K]

I think this is a good plan ^^^. Many people come here with rather romantic ideas about keeping chickens, but you sound more realistic. Just be aware.

Absolute decades ago, I had my first chickens and it has been a wonderful hobby.

see how things go. I

is a dang good way to do it.

Probably the biggest issue in the beginning is space and number of birds. Measure the space-start with less than that number of birds.

Good luck

Mrs K