Newbie in Montana

[Nomadicus]

Hello and Welcome to BYC!

 

[rural mouse]

Welcome to BYC. As a fellow Montanan, I'm gonna share some experience.

1. Build for the cold. If you can, run an underground conduit to your coop/run for an electrical outlet. Hauling water and -30 not including windchill is NOT for the faint of heart.

2. Ventilation: keeps the humidity down which helps avoid frostbite

3. Rate of laying: having birds lay every day isn't always a good thing. It can shorten lifespans. Also, some breeds can lay through the winter, others stop through deep winter.

4. Bird attributes: comb shape, wattles, feathered feet, crests, beards, muffs....
4a (and b). straight combs tend to be the largest: most prone to frostbite. Small combs are easier for birds to tuck into feathers to help keep them warm. Same holds true with wattles.
4c. Feathers on the feet can help keep feet warmer when not roosting. Flipside is they can get snow/mud stuck to them chilling the bird.
4d. Crests look all kinds of funky/fascinating. If water dish is a pan/bucket of some sort, they will get wet...including in winter. Full sized crests (like Polish chickens) can block their vision. If coop/run are Fort Knox, no worries. If not, be prepared to trim feathers around eyes so they can see possible predators.
4e. Beard/muffs: also get wet drinking out of buckets (nipple waterers don't have feathers getting wet problems, but can freeze). They also help cover wattles/earlobes (re: frostbite)

6. Mediterranean breeds tend to be long/slim built with feathers close to body. Heavier breeds they to be wider/deeper (stockier built) and have fluffier feathers. This translates to better able to shed heat vs better insulation.

7. Last points: free range (no fence/ area an acre plus) or coop/run confined? In town, edge of town, out in nowhere's villa? Predator issues: hawks/owl, stray dogs, coyotes/bobcats? All factor into coop build AND breed choices.

Not gonna tell you which breeds to get/not get. Just food for thought while you do some research into which breeds you're most interested in. Whatever you do for a coop, plan on having to keep them confined for several days at a time in the winter and make it correspondingly large. Also advise wind breaks. On at least 2 sides (the ones the wind blows from the most).

 

[yoyoma8686]

Hello and welcome to BYC! Glad you joined.

Nearly all the pullets/cockerels that someone acquires are incubator hatched and getting them away from that contraption as soon as possible is a good thing!

IF you someday can acquire chicks that were broody raised, they will be very aloof and independent. Not a bad thing at all.

Design the LARGEST coop and run you possibly are permitted and put a solid roof on the run for added protection. It also just makes the chicken keeping process so much easier.

Shoot for 3.5-4 sq ft per bird in the coop, with 1 linear foot of roost space, 1 nest box per every 4-5 birds and as close to 1 sq ft of permanently open ventilation as you can manage. Adding lots of roost level windows for additional summertime ventilation is great.

Attach the predator proof run to the coop and build it using 1/2" hardware cloth and cover every window and vent opening in the coop with the same to keep out small predators. And don't forget to add a 2' predator apron around the entire structure to prevent digging predators from gaining access.

Try to give the birds 15 sq ft of space per bird in the run. Put any dry organic matter you have ready access to on the run floor for scratching material and to slowly cold compost the poop load. Add lots of structure to the run like branches about 2 ft up attached to the corners for flying up to and perching, old wood stools or chairs (I have found countless numbers of these at curbside for garbage collection, free for the taking), wood pallets leaning against the run walls, stumps, etc. Avoid swings. Kids like swings. Chickens, not so much.
Oooh! And POOP BOARDS!! Try to incorporate poop boards into your coop.
These are mine with coffee ground bedding on them. You scoop them every morning with a kitty litter scoop and dump that into a bucket. When the bucket is full, you dump it into a compost pile that feeds your flower and vegetable gardens each year.

View attachment 3520763
They make keeping everything clean and odor free so much easier.

Thank you! Especially about the sq ft rules for ventilation. My plan was to do deep litter method with pull out tray. Can I still do deep litter AND add the coffee grounds? I have lots of coffee grounds I could use. Also it looks like your roosting bars are the same height instead of tiered. Do you like that set up better?

 

[yoyoma8686]

Welcome to BYC. It might be in your best interest to order chicks from a hatchery.

That's my plan as of right now. We have one about 15 minutes away!

 

[yoyoma8686]

Welcome to BYC. As a fellow Montanan, I'm gonna share some experience.

1. Build for the cold. If you can, run an underground conduit to your coop/run for an electrical outlet. Hauling water and -30 not including windchill is NOT for the faint of heart.

2. Ventilation: keeps the humidity down which helps avoid frostbite

3. Rate of laying: having birds lay every day isn't always a good thing. It can shorten lifespans. Also, some breeds can lay through the winter, others stop through deep winter.

4. Bird attributes: comb shape, wattles, feathered feet, crests, beards, muffs....
4a (and b). straight combs tend to be the largest: most prone to frostbite. Small combs are easier for birds to tuck into feathers to help keep them warm. Same holds true with wattles.
4c. Feathers on the feet can help keep feet warmer when not roosting. Flipside is they can get snow/mud stuck to them chilling the bird.
4d. Crests look all kinds of funky/fascinating. If water dish is a pan/bucket of some sort, they will get wet...including in winter. Full sized crests (like Polish chickens) can block their vision. If coop/run are Fort Knox, no worries. If not, be prepared to trim feathers around eyes so they can see possible predators.
4e. Beard/muffs: also get wet drinking out of buckets (nipple waterers don't have feathers getting wet problems, but can freeze). They also help cover wattles/earlobes (re: frostbite)

6. Mediterranean breeds tend to be long/slim built with feathers close to body. Heavier breeds they to be wider/deeper (stockier built) and have fluffier feathers. This translates to better able to shed heat vs better insulation.

7. Last points: free range (no fence/ area an acre plus) or coop/run confined? In town, edge of town, out in nowhere's villa? Predator issues: hawks/owl, stray dogs, coyotes/bobcats? All factor into coop build AND breed choices.

Not gonna tell you which breeds to get/not get. Just food for thought while you do some research into which breeds you're most interested in. Whatever you do for a coop, plan on having to keep them confined for several days at a time in the winter and make it correspondingly large. Also advise wind breaks. On at least 2 sides (the ones the wind blows from the most).

This is the kind of stuff I want to know, escpecially 4c & 6! Thank you!

 

[rural mouse]

This is the kind of stuff I want to know, escpecially 4c & 6! Thank you!

Also, prefab coops tend to be thin walled....unless you get one built by the Amish or Hutterites. I suggest building from scratch or converting a garden shed. If you're building from scratch, frame it like you would a house so you have some depth on the walls that can me insulated. It doesn't have to be more than covering the studs on the inside for the air pocket, but helps buffer the temps (and particularly the wind). Clad the outside in some sort of siding.

If you're out in the country/going to free range, breeds with "flighty" in the description will be an asset. They tend to be very alert and willing to fly (short distances), making them more likely to spot and escape from predators. Breeds that like to sit around the coop would be better if you're building fort Knox and they won't leave it. If you're building an old school cattle barn and only putting in a handful of birds, anything that catches your fancy will work. Just plan on handling them a lot as chicks and teach them that humans bring goodies so the come to you rather than perch in the rafters to watch you.

 

[DobieLover]

Thank you! Especially about the sq ft rules for ventilation. My plan was to do deep litter method with pull out tray. Can I still do deep litter AND add the coffee grounds? I have lots of coffee grounds I could use. Also it looks like your roosting bars are the same height instead of tiered. Do you like that set up better?

Deep litter and poop boards are a contradiction in poop management.

The way deep litter works is that the poop load composts in the litter throughout the year with regular mixing.

Poop boards are designed to remove the vast majority of the poop that is deposited at night by scooping the boards each morning.

Poop boards and deep bedding are complimentary. Deep bedding can stay in the coop for up to a year because it doesn't accumulate very much poop.

I keep all of my roosts at the same height to remove one factor that causes squabbling at roost time.

 

[MommaG2023]

Welcome to BYC. Simple advice..BEWARE of chicken math it is Truly a thing!! 5, 8, 11, now 19 later I can attest to the powers of chicken math lol also get your Coop and run FINISHED Before if absolutely possible... procrastinating leads to a lot of "if only" later and NO you do not have enough time if you get your chicks before your Coop is finished...believe me. Good luck with your chicken journey and as a side note there are a ton of great people on her with vast knowledge of almost everything you could need help with. The people here are great

 

[Chipmunk Chicks]

Welcome! It sounds like you've gotten lots of good advice. There's a lot to consider! You may want to start by seeing which breeds your local hatchery carries, and begin to narrow down your search from there.

My understanding is what I have in my coop is actually deep bedding. I use hemp and it stays there all year. I aerate it daily or so with a cultivator, have added to it maybe once in the fall to beef up the ground insulation for winter, and am getting ready to change it all out, hopefully before fly season. I don't use poop boards, but I see how they could be helpful. My run does not have deep litter, which is where that would be in my case, except I move my run around every few days or week, so they are on fresh grass. If you have a permanent run, you can use just about any free wood chips for deep litter in the run (just do your due diligence if you can about what trees could be harmful?) Vs. a tractor style, which is essentially what I have.

At the end of the day, no two keepers will do things exactly the same way, and that's okay! You'll find what works for you, your chickens, and your family.

My kids Love the chickens and ducks. It feels like such a gift to be able to raise them with the animals. I'm sure yours will enjoy, too!

Feel free to PM me (or whichever members) with specific questions if you're more comfortable with that, vs. posting a new thread. But please don't be shy to do that either, since we all learn from each other. Again, welcome!

 

[sqatkins]

Welcome to BYC @yoyoma8686

Great that you could join us all here! The learning Center has lot‘s of info on getting started and you can find it here ~ https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/categories/learning-center.11/

Enjoy BYC

Hello, I’m located in Montana and researching raising chickens. I plan to start my flock in the spring of 2024 and am making use of my time now gathering materials and planning.

My main motivation for raising chickens is for better food security/self reliance and knowing where my food comes from. We also have kiddos allergic to cats and dogs so an outdoor animal seems to be the way to go for us since they’ve passed exposure tests to other chickens so far.

I am more of a crunchy/attachment parenting sort of person, and I’m kinda bummed I can’t free range my chickens due to regulations, and I’m also undecided on how to obtain my chickens because I want my chickens not to have been separated too soon from their mama. Haha! Im already protective and I don’t even own them.

I’m very much a planner and like gathering info which brings me here, but I am also very adaptable in the moment and think I’ll do just fine “listening” to my chickens and responding appropriately.

Any advice is welcome!

Welcome to the club of chicken tenders. I'm in Missoula. Where are you? I'd be happy to advise as questions come up.

If you want a flock that is responsive to you, I recommend getting chicks as early as you can do so and raise them in a brooder so that they imprint on YOU as the main source of everything good. Birds that I have acquired when they are older are hard to win over as friends.

Hatchery chicks MUST be shipped right away because they can only go about 3 days without eating. They use up the energy from the yolk they consumed while in the egg in that time. Can't ship birds older than that or they will need to eat and drink in transit, and there is no way to do that, unless of course you want a very long road trip and transport themselves. Unfortunately, we don't have any major hatcheries in our state. You can probably find someone with a broody hen to sell you mixed breed chicks, but be aware that half of them will likely be roosters. (More on that later.)

I'm not sure where you are, but check with your local jurisdictional gov't (be it city, or county) to make sure you know what the regulations are in your area for numbers of chickens and whether or not you are allowed a rooster. Then plan accordingly.

Build the coop larger than your planned flock size dictates because Chicken Math means you will always want, or unexpectedly get, more (if allowed)! Make sure it is not drafty with no cracks between boards or leaks around doors, yet has ventilation up high where the vapors rise. You don't want the ventilation to create a draft down low where the chickens are roosting. Cold drafts kill chickens.

Allow a foot of linear roosting space per bird. The perches should NOT be small round dowels. Chickens prefer to roost with their feet almost flat, so use something at least 3" across. This way, in a Montana winter, they can hunch down on the roosting bar and cover their feet with their breast feathers to keep them warm.

Research and buy breeds that are cold hardy. This usually means that they have a smaller comb. I do have Rhode Island Reds with medium sized combs and they do pretty well. Wyandottes have rose combs and are a good choice. I also have an Easter Egger with a pea comb, and a Buff Orpington. If you google "cold hardy chicken breeds" you will get a long list. Stick to those.

Be aware that if you buy locally hatched chicks from another backyard chicken owner, or if you buy "straight run" chickens at a feed store, your chances are that you will end up with half of the flock being roosters. The ideal ratio of roosters to hens is 1:10 or 1:15. You certainly don't want half a flock of roosters. I don't keep a rooster, partly because I am not allowed one in the city of Missoula. But also, if you have a rooster you run the risk of having unexpected chicks, and half of those will be roosters. Having a rooster often leads to an unending cycle of looking for places to get rid of young roosters! Sometimes, despite your best efforts, you get a chick that turns out to be a rooster, even when the professionals sexed the chicken at hatching and determined it to be a female. It happens, and it's a PITA. I've had 3 roosters "by accident" appear in my flock. Thankfully I was able to sell the first because he was a pure breed. The other two were mixed breeds and got re-homed in a local rooster "sanctuary," such as it is.

All that said, I wish I had started raising chickens decades ago. I absolutely find being with my chickens as one of the best parts of my day, and the eggs are an added bonus. I hope that you will discover this joy too.