Not an Emergency...Marek's in the Flock

[Haunted55]

I have reached a point where I need input from those of you who are also facing this problem. I have 4 Marek's hens left and one is suffering from severe prolapse and her keel bone is extremely prominent. These girls eat as if there's no tomorrow and will never be anything except what they are due to the disease. I have some of their offspring hatched and at the 4 month age. One roo from this group just died a few days ago showing the leg paralysis and constant eating. No cocci, no respiratory issues, happy until he was no more. The others in this group are normal sized and very healthy so I guess there is merit to raising for immunity. I guess what I need to know is if it is worth it in the end, or should I just say goodbye and cull the poor girls left. I know this has to be a personal choice but I would really like some input.

It would be easy to cull the ones affected, but then what? Replace them? Okay, but how long do they have to stay apart even if they're vaccinated for Marek's? 6 months? A year? What about my original flock of layers and roo? They will be 2 years old in April. Do they go as well? They never had any symptoms of Marek's, but have been living with these survivors for months now. A lot of questions that I hope some of you can help me work through.

 

[Harry Rooster]

So sorry for you. I may be having this also, don't know yet, waiting for the necropsy report to tell if it's Marek's of Lymphoma, and then I guess they will tell me what I should do. Personally, I hope they don't tell me to cull. I've never had to do that and I've had chickens for about 7 years now. I know that's a hard decision. Sorry I don't know enough to give you input, just kind words of compassion, I'll be looking to see what others may advise you, so I'll know if my time comes around. Sorry.

 

[jerryse]

Cull all marecks birds.They are shedding live virus.Most likely infected during first month of life and symptoms appear at about 6 months.Hold off on chicks for awhile.After all birds are well past the age symptoms appear then think about chicks.Keep them away from your flock so they do not get infected.Said to be spread by dander from infected birds.After chicks are 2 months or so old it is said they can not be infected.This is from memory.A sure fire way is skip chicks for one year.All carriers are dead by then and no virus should have survived that long without a host.

 

[Harry Rooster]

Cull all marecks birds.They are shedding live virus.Most likely infected during first month of life and symptoms appear at about 6 months.Hold off on chicks for awhile.After all birds are well past the age symptoms appear then think about chicks.Keep them away from your flock so they do not get infected.Said to be spread by dander from infected birds.After chicks are 2 months or so old it is said they can not be infected.This is from memory.A sure fire way is skip chicks for one year.All carriers are dead by then and no virus should have survived that long without a host.

Since you said that after chicks are 2 mo old or so, does that mean that my cockerel (almost 1 yr old) can not catch this from the new pullets we just got that may have this? They are in a seperate pen and he is free range, but he caught something, cause he got respiratory problems with other symptoms. So even if they have Marek's, being he is free range and older, he wouldn't catch this from them just through airborne particles?

 

[Haunted55]

Since you said that after chicks are 2 mo old or so, does that mean that my cockerel (almost 1 yr old) can not catch this from the new pullets we just got that may have this? They are in a seperate pen and he is free range, but he caught something, cause he got respiratory problems with other symptoms. So even if they have Marek's, being he is free range and older, he wouldn't catch this from them just through airborne particles?

If you have the skin form of Marek's , then yes, he can. That stuff can be transported 50 miles on the wind. Mine have never shown any of those symptoms. They just go straight to the neurological, paralysis, and or the occular. These hens are almost a year old now. They are fertile, they are just special needs birds and always will be.

 

[Haunted55]

So sorry for you. I may be having this also, don't know yet, waiting for the necropsy report to tell if it's Marek's of Lymphoma, and then I guess they will tell me what I should do. Personally, I hope they don't tell me to cull. I've never had to do that and I've had chickens for about 7 years now. I know that's a hard decision. Sorry I don't know enough to give you input, just kind words of compassion, I'll be looking to see what others may advise you, so I'll know if my time comes around. Sorry.

Let me ask you this, are your birds full size? Does the feed to weight gain look normal? What are their ages? Marek's shows up at around 8-10 weeks of age, usually. It can affect older birds as well. It's been my experience that when it does it's usually the occular form or all of a sudden getting all kinds of different diesease that are not affecting the other birds. I hope you find that it isn't Marek's not that lymphoma is much better....

 

[Haunted55]

Cull all marecks birds.They are shedding live virus.Most likely infected during first month of life and symptoms appear at about 6 months.Hold off on chicks for awhile.After all birds are well past the age symptoms appear then think about chicks.Keep them away from your flock so they do not get infected.Said to be spread by dander from infected birds.After chicks are 2 months or so old it is said they can not be infected.This is from memory.A sure fire way is skip chicks for one year.All carriers are dead by then and no virus should have survived that long without a host.

Thank-you for your response. Not always dander, sometimes just sharing the drinking water and feeder. Also can be spread through fecal droppings similar to cocci. It has been my experience that they can get it after 2 months, or at least become symptomatic. And yet others exposed show no symptoms at all and develope the way they should. My land is infested with this now as these birds were allowed to free range last Summer and Fall. Marek's can live for years in stasis without a host. This is the problem I face.

 

[Harry Rooster]

The new pullets we got are the culprets. No they were malnourished, and ragged looking when we got them. We have had chickens for about 7 yrs or more, and never had any symptoms of any diseases, all free range, only predator problems here, until we got these. I put them in a pen by themselves, but my cockerel (will be 1 yr old on Easter day) was over there nosing around checking out the new chicks a couple of days before he started showing symptoms of diarreha, runny nose, wouldn't eat or drink, just standing sleeping always. I immediately got him into a big cage that day away from everyone and started treating him with Tetracycline, he seems recovered now, other than the worm I saw yesterday on his paper in his cage. I have not returned him to the yard yet due to needing to worm him now and waiting for the cold and rain to stop first. Also been putting ACV in his water, and at the beginning, electrolytes and fed yougart. But the pullets, lost 2 right off the bat, have another in my hosp. still coughing after treating with antibiotics for 2 wks ACV and electrolytes. Then yesterday morn. found another in the pen on her back with legs straight up in the air. Have her now in the cat carrier in my hosp, since I don't have any more cages or space, she can't stand anyway. Drinks excessively, won't eat, shaking her head and slinging fluid whenever she shakes her head, water pooh that just squirts out, almost all water, lots of it. sickly eyes, pale face. She is the only one that has been this bad so far. The other 2 that died ate and drank all the way up until they died (pretty quickly) with no paralysis. I don't know, I've never been faced with this stuff before or anything like it. I first thought they had caught a cold due to the rain and cold. But I noticed that they smelled bad the day they brought them, but I thought that it was because he had been keeping them in a horse pen with a bunch of others. Boy was I stupid. But my cockerel has always been very healthy not even mites or anything that I know of. He never drank their water or ate their food, only looked at them through the wire, had to be airborne, or either transported on my shoes across the yard, I didn't know about biosecurity, or that this was even possible. None of my other free range chickens or cockerel has any symptoms of anything, and they free range same place my other cockerel did. I'm confused.

 

[Haunted55]

The new pullets we got are the culprets. No they were malnourished, and ragged looking when we got them. We have had chickens for about 7 yrs or more, and never had any symptoms of any diseases, all free range, only predator problems here, until we got these. I put them in a pen by themselves, but my cockerel (will be 1 yr old on Easter day) was over there nosing around checking out the new chicks a couple of days before he started showing symptoms of diarreha, runny nose, wouldn't eat or drink, just standing sleeping always. I immediately got him into a big cage that day away from everyone and started treating him with Tetracycline, he seems recovered now, other than the worm I saw yesterday on his paper in his cage. I have not returned him to the yard yet due to needing to worm him now and waiting for the cold and rain to stop first. Also been putting ACV in his water, and at the beginning, electrolytes and fed yougart. But the pullets, lost 2 right off the bat, have another in my hosp. still coughing after treating with antibiotics for 2 wks ACV and electrolytes. Then yesterday morn. found another in the pen on her back with legs straight up in the air. Have her now in the cat carrier in my hosp, since I don't have any more cages or space, she can't stand anyway. Drinks excessively, won't eat, shaking her head and slinging fluid whenever she shakes her head, water pooh that just squirts out, almost all water, lots of it. sickly eyes, pale face. She is the only one that has been this bad so far. The other 2 that died ate and drank all the way up until they died (pretty quickly) with no paralysis. I don't know, I've never been faced with this stuff before or anything like it. I first thought they had caught a cold due to the rain and cold. But I noticed that they smelled bad the day they brought them, but I thought that it was because he had been keeping them in a horse pen with a bunch of others. Boy was I stupid. But my cockerel has always been very healthy not even mites or anything that I know of. He never drank their water or ate their food, only looked at them through the wire, had to be airborne, or either transported on my shoes across the yard, I didn't know about biosecurity, or that this was even possible. None of my other free range chickens or cockerel has any symptoms of anything, and they free range same place my other cockerel did. I'm confused.

This sounds respiratory and not like marek's.

• [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Coryza [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Bacteria – [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Hemophilus paragallinarum [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Symptoms[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]: swollen head and wattles, nasal discharge, rattles, egg production drop, diarrhea.
Transmission: direct bird to bird contact, contaminated feed and water; recovered birds remain
carriers.
Prevention/Control: sanitation and biosecurity, avoid mixing flocks; appropriate antibiotics, [/FONT][/FONT]​

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]birds tend to relapse once medication is finished; vaccination in problem farms. [/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]• [FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Mycoplasma (CRD – Chronic Respiratory Disease) [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]MG – [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Mycoplasma gallisepticum [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]MS – [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Mycoplasma synoviae [/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]Symptoms[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]: none to nasal and eye discharge, rattles, sneezing, birds stunted and unthrifty;
lameness, swollen joints, weight loss.
Transmission: from hen to chick through the egg; direct bird to bird contact from respiratory
secretions with can contaminate bootwear, clothing and equipment.
Prevention/Control: Eradication is the best control, maintain mycoplasma-free breeders, practice [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]​

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman][FONT=Times New Roman,Times New Roman]strict isolation; appropriate antibiotics to stop outbreak, but can create carriers. [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]

 

[Overoberyl]

The new pullets we got are the culprets. No they were malnourished, and ragged looking when we got them. We have had chickens for about 7 yrs or more, and never had any symptoms of any diseases, all free range, only predator problems here, until we got these. I put them in a pen by themselves, but my cockerel (will be 1 yr old on Easter day) was over there nosing around checking out the new chicks a couple of days before he started showing symptoms of diarreha, runny nose, wouldn't eat or drink, just standing sleeping always. I immediately got him into a big cage that day away from everyone and started treating him with Tetracycline, he seems recovered now, other than the worm I saw yesterday on his paper in his cage. I have not returned him to the yard yet due to needing to worm him now and waiting for the cold and rain to stop first. Also been putting ACV in his water, and at the beginning, electrolytes and fed yougart. But the pullets, lost 2 right off the bat, have another in my hosp. still coughing after treating with antibiotics for 2 wks ACV and electrolytes. Then yesterday morn. found another in the pen on her back with legs straight up in the air. Have her now in the cat carrier in my hosp, since I don't have any more cages or space, she can't stand anyway. Drinks excessively, won't eat, shaking her head and slinging fluid whenever she shakes her head, water pooh that just squirts out, almost all water, lots of it. sickly eyes, pale face. She is the only one that has been this bad so far. The other 2 that died ate and drank all the way up until they died (pretty quickly) with no paralysis. I don't know, I've never been faced with this stuff before or anything like it. I first thought they had caught a cold due to the rain and cold. But I noticed that they smelled bad the day they brought them, but I thought that it was because he had been keeping them in a horse pen with a bunch of others. Boy was I stupid. But my cockerel has always been very healthy not even mites or anything that I know of. He never drank their water or ate their food, only looked at them through the wire, had to be airborne, or either transported on my shoes across the yard, I didn't know about biosecurity, or that this was even possible. None of my other free range chickens or cockerel has any symptoms of anything, and they free range same place my other cockerel did. I'm confused.

It sounds like you may be dealing with Infectious coryza, since you mention a bad smell. It definitely does not sound like Marek's. Unfortunately since all of your birds have been exposed, even those that do not become ill will still be carriers of the disease for life, and will infect any new birds you may bring in. Similarly, if you sell or give any away they will carry the disease with them. If it is IC, you can either cull all of your birds, wait several months and start over, or maintain a completely closed flock in order to prevent spreading the disease to someone else. Still, if you have neighbors with chickens they might still be at risk, and if you visit friends who have chickens same thing. This is why I never buy adult birds anymore, and the few times that I did they were in strict quarantine away from all of my others for 2 months minimum. Sorry you are dealing with this but it sounds quite serious and I would recommend if you aren't already, get some Oxine and start using it everywhere...good luck.