Want to ditch the store feed

[Shadrach]

Note that your comment that hens will still lay eggs on some truly terrible diets applies to commercial feed too.

The key thing a commercial feed does is satisfy AVERAGE requirements (optimal, I think not). So most individuals are actually poorly served by it because they are not, in fact, average. The free choice feeding research shows that not only is it better for the health of the animals, but it is even more efficient for the pocket of the person buying the feed, if the animals are allowed to select their own ration.

The papers on this for chickens were given in the thread on new research debunks trad advice, and here's a paper that shows it for cattle too https://practicalfarmers.b-cdn.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Atwood-et-al-2001-tmr-vs-choice.pdf

I view my responsibility to put aside my personal views, agendas, campaings and give what I consider the most balanced advice given the information I have from the OP's question.
As both you and I have discovered through experience, feeding an alternative diet isn't quite as straightforward as it initially seemed. Both you and I have made quite considerable changes to our feeds over time; your first and second articles for examples and my posting on my thread.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/ar...eat-tears-a-calculator-or-deep-pockets.78655/

https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/wholesome-homemade-feed-2.79307/

As examples, I wondered why the chickens I care for craved bread and I finally worked out that the diet I fed them was low in salt and it was the salt in the bread the chickens were after. Fermented wheat and peas didn't work for me or the chickens and a further complication is the chickens diet choices change thrughout the year; availability is one reason but also the need for other nutrients depending on their state of health and time of year.

If one has a wide variety of plants and bugs such as you have in your garden it's probable the chicken can find what it needs. Not many people have such a range of food options. Another factor is free range on a quarter acre plot mostly covered in grass is nothing like the same as free range on mutiple acres of mixed vegitation.

It's not that alternative feeds won't work but to work well there are other factors such as available forage, time out of coop and run, quality of the forage etc etc.
I would also point out there are no long term (hatch to death) studies on the effect of a particular alternative feeding regime.

There are numerous fad feeding regimes on the internet for both people and chickens, very few of which are based on any long term evidence.
My view is anyone who posts on BYC questions about these alternative feeding regimes has not done sufficient research, or the calculations necessary to undertake such a venture and any advice given should bear this in mind.

 

[saysfaa]

I view ...

I agree.

Just want the add (emphasize? maybe) that I want people to ask on the forum even if they are just starting to explore the topic.

 

[Perris]

an alternative diet

it is a traditional diet. It is alternative only in the sense that it is not commercial.

there are no long term (hatch to death) studies on the effect of a particular alternative feeding regime.

Actually, there are the thousands of years of chicken keeping before big ag arrived. What is absent is long term studies on the effect of commercial feed for longer than 6 weeks in the case of broilers or 2 years in the case of laying hens. Those that exist on trying to keep broilers alive long enough to breed are eye-opening.

 

[Bawkbok]

This is our first experience with chickens; it's an all new experience. I have made many mistakes but learn from each one in the past 7 months. One of the many mysteries is commercial feed and I know there are numerous lengthy posts here about various feed types, when to feed what, etc. I've also read the article on feed. It can be overwhelming to a newbie and inexperienced chicken keeper. I prefer to feed natural, wholesome feed made in my own kitchen, but have not ventured into that yet since I don't have the knowledge of what is required in what increments at various life stages. I wouldn't want to mess that up and create health issues. I haven't had the time yet to search the article database for a 'made from scratch' menu per life stage.
I appreciate the list from Altairsky as to what is in the feed but knowing the percentages, mixtures and volume, etc. would be most helpful. As a novice, I appreciate all the offerings of information and advice from the experience of others. Thank you all for sharing your insight.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

There are numerous fad feeding regimes on the internet for both people and chickens, very few of which are based on any long term evidence.
My view is anyone who posts on BYC questions about these alternative feeding regimes has not done sufficient research, or the calculations necessary to undertake such a venture and any advice given should bear this in mind.

Echoing both.

The stuff you find on Youtube, pretty consistently, is neither cost effective nor adequate in its nutritional offerings. There are numerous posts which can be found on this forum taking one after another apart. Search "beans and pasta" as example.

and as someone who knows a tiny bit about feeding chickens - enough that i get summoned to this forum w/ some frequency - I can tell you with absolute certainty tha tthe more I learn on the topic, the less inclined I am to try and "make my own".

Asking questions is GOOD. But if a poster is still at the general question asking stage, they are a LONG LONG ways from having the education needed to reasonably evaluate options and make intelligent choices about how to feed their birds.

and yes, fenugreek seed (methi) has relatively high amounts of Methionine as compared to most plants. Soy has a very good amino acid profile (for a plant) which is why soy meal is so popular in US chicken feeds. Many oil seeds (i.e. sunflower, safflower) have decent Met levels and are otherwise nutritionally dense, but contain so much fat that it is hard to balance a ration with them at inclusion rates high enough to compensate for the Met deficiencies in grains, generally.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

and @Boots001 apart from my general advice "don't do this" (for a lot of reasons I'm not going to list here, which you will soon discover for yourself), I'm going to offer a bit of specific advice.

Go hunt the web (or here on BYC) and find Justin Rhodes "make at home" recipe. The nutritional outputs when you put it into a feed calculator are reasonable, and in line with recommendations, comparable to many commercial feeds (better than some, worse than others).

Once you have the recipe, research the individual ingredients until you are comfortable you know why the were included, and presnet in the amounts specified. Give some thought to what would happen to the overall nutrition if you increased or decreased the amount of one of them. If you check your assumptions, and find yourself consistently right in your expectations, you are ready to go to the store, price out your recipe, and look at what "else" you might have in potential ingredients to choose from. Write down their prices too.

Go home, research them. Are there any substitutions worthy of consideration? If not, and its still at a price you are willing to pay, and an amount of labor you are willing to invest, go for it! as I said above, his recipe is comparable to commercial feeds of similar purpose, and unlike most youtube/facebook recipes, actually has the benefit of long term use by lots of people with satisfactory results - its not just theory.

and if you are still passionate about it? Look up a guy named Joel Salatin. He has a recipe or two as well. He also has a Method. His recipe works with his method as part of a cohesive management practice. When you understand how and why that works - its benefits, and its limits, then you can jump into the weeds with us on some of the research and really talk feed.

Looking forward to it.

 

[Bawkbok]

Thank you all for the comments and information. I am highly interested in creating home feed and realize it will take much time to research.
Aside from what is gleaned here, I am delving into Feeding Poultry by G.F. Heuser, Cornell University, 1955, a publication I'm sure many of you, especially those with scientific academia, are familiar. I do not have a scientific education, so I find this read fascinating and most informative. There is much to digest (pun intended) and I look forward to the learning process.