What does this teach me about the parents genes?

[Taylor12777]

Hello. (I know nothing about genetics) I recently paired my Silver Laced Wyandotte Rooster to my Splash Silkie Hen. I collected and incubated 6 of their eggs and all 6 hatched. I have attached pictures of each of the 6 chicks that this cross created as well as a photo of my roo and hen. I guess what I'm wondering is what the offspring can tell me about my hen and Rooster genetics. All 6 of the chicks have 5 toes (like silkie mom) and super feathered feet (like silkie mom) I think all 6 will end up being beautiful as they grow, and I know theyll look completely different when they feather out. But do their current patterns/coloring tell you guys anything specific about their parents ? Bonus if you have any possibilities (with pictures) of what they'll look like when they're older. Of course I know there will be different possibilities depending on gender. I'm trying to learn as much as I can about my roo, because I would like to try a few different crosses with him later on, and I've also considered crossing my silkie again, but I don't want to cross them if there is anything alarming you guys can see. All the chicks appear healthy though and no deformities or anything. But I just want to be cautious.
If these pictures or this story look familiar, it's because I made another post in a different thread before they ever hatched. But now I'm actually gonna post in the genetics group so hopefully more experienced ones can see this and offer advice

 

[Vulpes vulpes]

Are you 100% sure that all of these came from splash mom? Because if I know what I'm taking about (I might not ) then with a black pattern dad and splash mom, 100% of the chicks should display as blue. To me, only 1, 5, and maybe 6 look blue. I can't tell with 2 because of its pattern(it'll turn out beautiful though!), but 3 and 4 are definitely not blue. Any chance there could have been a mix up?

 

[Taylor12777]

Are you 100% sure that all of these came from splash mom? Because if I know what I'm taking about (I might not ) then with a black pattern dad and splash mom, 100% of the chicks should display as blue. To me, only 1, 5, and maybe 6 look blue. I can't tell with 2 because of its pattern(it'll turn out beautiful though!), but 3 and 4 are definitely not blue. Any chance there could have been a mix up?

Absolutely no possibility that there was a mixup. I only have 1 rooster and I had them separated into a different pen and it was only my SLW Rooster, 2 SLW pullets (not laying at the time) and my silkie. Even if somehow my SLW Pullets laid during that time, their eggs are darker tan. My silkies eggs are white. Butttt, something that was brought up to me in another thread was that she may not be a true splash. Also, the stripe pattern on some of them come from the SLW side. The rooster as a chick had those stripes, except he was black with white stripes on his back and a dot on his head

 

[Vulpes vulpes]

Butttt, something that was brought up to me in another thread was that she may not be a true splash.

That could be the case. Mottle, maybe? The math just isn't matching with splash though! Whatever it is, it'll be really exciting to see how these chicks develop!

 

[Taylor12777]

That could be the case. Mottle, maybe? The math just isn't matching with splash though! Whatever it is, it'll be really exciting to see how these chicks develop!

The mother as a chick if this is helpful at all. (That is her adoptive mom, obviously not her biological)

 

[Taylor12777]

The picture I posted with the rooster is the most up to date picture I have of her, taken like 2 weeks ago. She is a year and 2 months old. She sure looks like a splash, but obviously her genes don't show she's true splash

Mom at 4 weeks

Mom at 6 weeks

 

[NatJ]

Absolutely no possibility that there was a mixup. I only have 1 rooster and I had them separated into a different pen and it was only my SLW Rooster, 2 SLW pullets (not laying at the time) and my silkie. Even if somehow my SLW Pullets laid during that time, their eggs are darker tan. My silkies eggs are white.

Did any of the Wyandotte pullets have contact with any other male within the month or so before you collected the eggs that hatched these chicks?

All 6 of the chicks have 5 toes (like silkie mom) and super feathered feet (like silkie mom)

The chicks are definitely Silkie-mixes, not pure Wyandottes.

This is a good check on her actually being the mother: with that father, the chicks must have a mother with feathered feet and 5 toes. Since she is the only hen with those traits in that breeding pen, that means she must be the mother.

If the Wyandotte pullets had previously mated with a Silkie male, and if you then mixed up their eggs with the Silkie's eggs, you could have Silkie-mix chicks that way. But if the Wyandotte pullets had no contact with other males, and if you are confident you did not mix up the eggs from this pen with any other pen, then the Silkie hen is the only possible mother.

do their current patterns/coloring tell you guys anything specific about their parents ?

What I think I can tell about the hen's genes for color:
--She has the gene Extended Black, which makes the chicken black all over, at least until other genes change that. Or possibly Birchen, which can also make the chicken pretty much black. I'm pretty sure of that because of chicks #3 and #4.
--She only has one gene for Extended Black or Birchen, and to pair with it she has some other gene at the same locus (place on the chromosome). The other gene was inherited by chick #2 for sure, probably chick #6, and I'm not sure about chicks #1 and #5. Whichever gene the Silkie had (there are about 3 options), it is one that allows the chicks to show patterns of silver-and-black instead of being black all over. The stripey back on chick #2 is the strongest evidence for the Silkie hen having such a gene.

The Silkie hen looks like she is Splash. Splash is caused by two blue genes, turning all the black areas on a chicken into a light color (white or gray) with bits of blue or black. That poses problems any way I try to interpret it.

--Splash would mean she has two blue genes. That would mean she gives one to each chick. But chick #3 and chick #4 do not look like they have blue. So either they are a very dark blue (can be mistaken for black), or something else is going on here.

--Her appearance could possibly be caused by Extended Black or Birchen (makes her black pretty much all over), with Silver leakage (makes white patches) and then diluted by the blue gene (makes some areas gray). If that is so, she would have just one blue gene and one not-blue gene, which would account for the colors of the chicks (chicks #1 and #5 inherited the blue gene, chicks #3 and #4 would not have the blue gene in this scenario, and I'm not sure about #2 and #6). But this is not the most likely way to explain her appearance, so I'm not really happy with this explanation either.

I think we can rule out:
--Paint chickens look white with black spots. Blue Paints are white with blue spots. Paint is caused by one copy of the Dominant White gene that turns black to white but misses some bits. I don't think the Silkie hen looks particularly like Paint. If the Silkie hen had Dominant White, she would be expected to give it to half of her chicks, but looking at the chicks we can see that none none of the chicks inherited Dominant White. With 6 chicks, there is only a 1 in 64 chance that the hen could have Dominant White and not produce any chicks showing it. I'm pretty strongly inclined to rule out this explanation.

I am sure we can rule out:
--Her appearance could possibly be from some pattern of white and black (probably not lacing, but something sort-of similar.) The texture of Silkie feathers could make part of it look gray. But if she had that, she would not be able to have either Extended Black or Birchen (because either of them is dominant over whatever she would have). Since she did produce chicks #3 and #4, who must have either Extended Black or Birchen, her own coloring cannot be caused by some kind of silver-and-black pattern.

In the picture when that hen was a young chick, she looks blue or splash. I haven't yet thought of any other explanations that fit well with her current appearance.

Mottle, maybe? The math just isn't matching with splash though!

That is an interesting point. I suppose Blue Mottled might almost do it, and would certainly explain how some chicks look blue and some do not. Her own chick picture is about right for a blue chick (could be a blue mottled chick), but she seems to have more white in the pictures when she is younger and less white now, which is backwards of the pattern with most mottled chickens (they tend to get more white with age.) So I think the pictures of the hen when she is young, that were posted after you suggested mottling, can tentatively rule out this explanation.

I agree, splash doesn't work out mathematically unless those "black" chicks are a really dark blue that is fooling us all. Maybe the answer will become obvious as they grow.

Bonus if you have any possibilities (with pictures) of what they'll look like when they're older. Of course I know there will be different possibilities depending on gender.

Here is a thread with lots of pictures of Silkie-mix chickens. Yours will probably have many of the traits you can see in pictures there.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/silkie-mix-thread-d.600928/

Specific predictions:
--All chicks will have normal-textured feathers, not silkie feathers. The gene for silkie feathers is recessive, so they will carry it but not show it.

--You already know your chicks have feathered feet and extra toes. They will probably also have crests on their heads when they grow up. Some of them appear to have beards. They might all have beards, but I'm not really sure.

--Chicks #3 and #4 will grow up to be black or dark blue. They may have some leakage of other colors (silver or red) as they get older.

--Chicks #1 and #5 will look blue when they grow up. They will be basically blue all over, but it might be lighter in some areas and darker in others. They might have leakage of other colors (silver or red). There is a chance of them having some pattern of silver and blue, but I think that is not very likely.
Some photos of blue chickens, showing various amounts of darker and lighter blue:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/reviews/sapphire-gem-dominate-blue-d-107.11837/
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...blue-star-and-is-it-as-crazy-as-mine.1487779/
(Your chicks will not grow up to look exactly like those pictures, because those chickens do not have the extra feathers your Silkie-mixes will have.)

--Chick #2 will have some kind of pattern with silver(white) and either blue or black. It might be similar to the father's Laced pattern, or it might be a bit different. I can't tell at this point.

--I think Chick #6 will have some kind of pattern as well, also silver with either blue or black. It may have a different pattern than chick #2, but I can't tell exactly what pattern either one will have.

I'm trying to learn as much as I can about my roo, because I would like to try a few different crosses with him later on, and I've also considered crossing my silkie again, but I don't want to cross them if there is anything alarming you guys can see. All the chicks appear healthy though and no deformities or anything. But I just want to be cautious.

I do not see anything alarming.
I would not expect any problems.

If these pictures or this story look familiar, it's because I made another post in a different thread before they ever hatched. But now I'm actually gonna post in the genetics group so hopefully more experienced ones can see this and offer advice

I'll figure on answering here, and not in the other thread now, to keep it all as tidy as possible (discussion mostly in one place.)

Overall, I don't know what to think about the hen and the chicks. I went through all my reasoning in hopes that if I'm wrong somewhere, maybe someone else will catch it.

 

[Taylor12777]

Its hard to see everyone good in one picture, but this was taken today! They were scared because my 4 year old was squealing. That's why they're huddled. Something I've noticed with these chicks, is that they are SO QUIET compared to any others I've had. They can/will chirp if they're separated or scared, so I know they can. But they just seem so content and happy. They all eat & drink well and play together (it's adorable they just started really playing)

 

[Taylor12777]

Did any of the Wyandotte pullets have contact with any other male within the month or so before you collected the eggs that hatched these chicks?

No. They hatched at a friend's house and we're brought here on day 2. So they've been here their whole life.

 

[Chicken_Obsesser]

They are so cute!!