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Working with the birds you had, I'm sure most of those susceptible to disease had been weeded out before you got them.I didn't get sick birds. I got lots of injuries and those that could be saved I treated.
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Working with the birds you had, I'm sure most of those susceptible to disease had been weeded out before you got them.I didn't get sick birds. I got lots of injuries and those that could be saved I treated.
The birds and nature tend to know what works best and I let them get on with it.
People have put a lot of effort into breeding chickens that do not go broody. Very strong selection, for many generations, can make big changes (like lack of broodiness.)In one of your previous posts you mentioned that chickens haven't changed much psychologically from their jungle fowl ancestors, and I agree. In that case, it'd be safe to assume that since chickens still have an instinct to stay alive, still have an instinct to form social groups (which ties in with the instinct to survive), then they must also have the instinct to reproduce, beyond just simple copulation. If that's the case, then why is natural brooding becoming more and more rare?
NatJ brings up some interesting points. It is always more complicated than the most simplistic answers. But the simplistic answer is that if you make going broody a capital offense where they literally lose their head for going broody and use an incubator to hatch eggs in a few generations you have a flock where very few go broody. Conversely if you hatch eggs from hens that go broody and use those chicks as your breeders you can soon have a flock that regularly goes broody. I did that, including the rooster, and soon practically every hen went broody for me at least once a year. Several more often than that.In one of your previous posts you mentioned that chickens haven't changed much psychologically from their jungle fowl ancestors, and I agree. In that case, it'd be safe to assume that since chickens still have an instinct to stay alive, still have an instinct to form social groups (which ties in with the instinct to survive), then they must also have the instinct to reproduce, beyond just simple copulation. If that's the case, then why is natural brooding becoming more and more rare?
People have put a lot of effort into breeding chickens that do not go broody. Very strong selection, for many generations, can make big changes (like lack of broodiness.)
And this selection has been going on for a long time, not just the most recent few decades. I have a book from about a century ago that talks about the Mediterranean chicken breeds being good layers but poor setters at that time. I have read of Egyptians using incubators more than 2000 years ago, although I can't tell how widespread that was and whether the knowledge died out for a while between then and now.
Other than that, the living conditions may make a difference as well. I don't know all the details that contribute, but some people seem to have lots of broody hens and some do not. I've read of chickens that go broody frequently while one person owns them, and not at all when a different person owns the very same hens (before or after). I can't say whether the difference is in the coop and living conditions, or something different about the feeding, or something else yet.
I've got a guess that hens will not go broody unless they store up a certain amount of body fat first, but I am pretty sure that is not the only factor.
I see quite a few discussions of broody hens on this forum, so I'm sure at least some chickens still have the right genes for it, along with whatever other conditions they need.
I suspect NatJ got that about the fat reserve from me. I mention it a lot. I can't remember where I first got that. I may have read it somewhere but I suspect it was from a Poultry Science professor that specialized in egg laying and reproduction.Your point about building a sufficient fat reserve is very interesting. I can only tell my experience, but the birds that have gone broody (this far, only two mix breed bantams) here were given feed that had higher protein than layer feed. My free range pen has layer feed included in their diet
I was actually thinking of the flock of @U_StormcrowI suspect NatJ got that about the fat reserve from me. I mention it a lot. I can't remember where I first got that. I may have read it somewhere but I suspect it was from a Poultry Science professor that specialized in egg laying and reproduction.
I've butchered enough pullets, hens, cockerels, and roosters to see that it sure sounds right. The girls typically have a lot of fat, the boys on the same feeding regimen as the girls (chicken feed plus forage) have a lot less, almost none.
To further mess up thinking, I was feeding a 15% protein Developer chicken feed with forage, kitchen wastes, garden excess and waste, and orchard excess and waste when I had a flock where every hen went broody at least once a year and many more often. I have no idea what their average daily protein intake was but it could not have been very high.
Regarding the fat stores, I just realized: the breeds that are traditionally considered non-broody (Mediterranean breeds) are also ones that are typically lean rather than having a lot of fat. The breeds that are reputed to go broody frequently tend to also be known for a tendency to get fat (example: Orpingtons)I'm not convinced human selection can make such drastic changes to such a primal instinct. Make it more difficult to present itself yes, but here we're talking about near complete eradication in some breeds amd production mixes. Since the brooding aspect is linked to other reproductive functions (such as copulation), wouldn't we have noticed some kind of difference there? Perhaps low fertility, or lack of reproductive drive in both males and females?
Your point about building a sufficient fat reserve is very interesting. I can only tell my experience, but the birds that have gone broody (this far, only two mix breed bantams) here were given feed that had higher protein than layer feed. My free range pen has layer feed included in their diet