Stripe on a Buckeye chick. Down question.

[Sparklee]

What E Locus are Buckeyes?

Do they carry Co? They don't, right?

Anyone know the genotype? That would cover the two questions above.

I have searched high and low, obviously in the wrong places, for at least 3 hours (2 of them during the middle of a sleep deprived night), looking at photos and trying to find the official chick down description of Buckeye chicks. In case you want to know, it's a rarity to find a photo online of a Buckeye chick with a dark line down the middle of its head. Although, finding "chicks" from Ohio called Buckeyes with lots of team spirit are pretty easy to find. Seach on Images Buckeye Chicks yourself for a good time.

Please tell me that someone knows the proper and official chick down description of the Buckeye. I'm reaching the end of my rope.

Somewhere in the back of my head or maybe in a dream, I thought I read that it was not okay for a Buckeye chick to have a dark line down the middle of the head. Does it mean that it's got an erratic or undesirable gene hidden in its breeding? Was its mother crossbred with something else?

 

[punky rooster]

A few of my buckeye chicks have a little bit of black on its head, and it comes from one of the oldest lines. So I think it is fine. I think it is because of the buckeye's heritage is why the chick's color varies a little.
I think that is your question....... Forgive me if I missunderstood you.

 

[tadkerson]

Quote:
Buckeyes are columbian restricted- if they were not columbian restricted they would have a black breast. There are other restrictors that remove the black breast but I can not see them being carried by a buckeye. They should be wheaten at the E locus. Dominant wheaten usually does not show any black in the down but recessive wheaten will. Buckeye chicks should look similar to rhode island red- a reddish wheaten down color. I would not worry about the mark on the head- it would not be unusual for recessive wheaten chicks to have black markings.

There is not an official down color but there is an official standard for adults. As long as the adults meet the standard-no big deal.

Tim

 

[Janet Hatch]

Janet Hatch
J Squared Farms
NW MO
NPIP 43-727

 

[Sparklee]

Quote:
Thanks, Tim.

I guess I figured that they were not Columbian because Punky implied they weren't Co in a few posts starting at:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=6082386#p6082386

I guess that I was thinking that with some breeds, if you see some features in the chick down, then you know you've got a bird that is not correct for the breed. For instance, if a Black Copper Marans hatches out with a dark gray underbelly, then something went wrong. Or if there is a strong brown tinge on a BCM's black head, I'm looking at a bird that may be carrying Db. Just because a bird meets the standard as an adult and I could show it, that doesn't always mean that it's wise for me to breed with it if I want to keep my reputation blemish free. I wondered if the black line on the Buckeyes' heads were indicative of bad breeding. I'm glad to hear that the markings are normal.

Now, I guess I'll continue my search for the genotype of the Buckeye. I found plenty of other breeds' genotypes, but no Buckeye genotype. Thanks for the eWh and ey info, too.

After rereading this to see how many typos/mistakes I made, I realized that it sounds like I do a lot of guessing.

 

[punky rooster]

Sorry, I probably missunderstood what I read. This is where I got it.

cgmccary [b :

First[/b], I would point out that one of your basic premises is actually wrong. A Buckeye is not a true "Columbian Red" as you call it. Buckeyes are a form of Black-tailed Red - though as different to Black-tailed Red as what Light Brown Leghorns are to BB Red or Dark Brown Leghorns to Partridge. They are not Columbian in color, but a derivative.​

 

[Sparklee]

Quote:
Really?

That sounds promising. Thanks.

 

[Sparklee]

Quote:

Well, that all just flew right over my head. But still "a-HA!" And maybe that's why that 4H mom's attempt at sexlinks seemed to have possibly failed.

Thanks so much for re-finding it and posting it here. I really appreciate it. I'm going to have to try to decipher it later. It's past my bedtime and I've got some dirty bottoms (on chicks) that need some cleaning before I can flop into bed. They had a rough trip.

 

[Sparklee]

Here's a link to a photo I finally found here on BYC that shows the little black lines on head. https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=271644&p=20 They were declared "okay" back then also, but I couldn't find them until after I had posted this question. I truly spent WAY too much time searching for the info. Interesting that the Janet Hatch photos have all clean heads. The clean heads are definitely more prevalent.

Now to try to figure out exactly what a black-tailed red is and what a Columbian derivative is. I look up "columbian red" and got all sorts of links to boa constrictors.

 

[tadkerson]

Quote:

I do not know where cgmccary got the information or how he or she interpreted the information. In my book buckeye are black tailed red, light brown leghorn are B B Red and dark brown leghorns are partridge. The Dark brown leghorn's E locus is called brown now or e^b; at one time the brown allele was called partridge (e^p) but changed to brown. This partridge is not to be confused with the partridge variety (partrideg rock) which is penciled.

They are correct in that buckeye are not a columbian red- this does not mean they are not columbian restricted; they are columbian restricted. If I am on the same page as cgmccary, a columbian red would be a completely red bird. Buckeye have a black tail-therefore buck eye are black-tailed red.

I believe cgmccary was referring to columbian as in silver columbian (columbian rock)- a gold columbian would be buff columbian ( brahma).


Buckeye genotype- for mahogany red birds

wheaten ey/ey or ewh/ewh, columbian Co/Co, mahogany Mh/Mh, gold s+/s+ or s+/¬_w , yellow skin w/w , yellow shanks due to w, ey and Id , slow feathering K/K or K/_w, dermal melanin inhibitor Id/Id or Id/_W, pea comb P/P r+/r+, genes for red ear lobes, genes for reddish bay eye color, any red under color is due to wheaten and mahogany, genes for brown egg color o+/o+.

I do not know why the back under color (gray) would be different than the under color on the rest of the bird. The body type is similar to a cornish game and has been selected for through breeding.

I do not believe buckeye carry the dark brown gene. The color is different in wheaten and dark brown restricted birds- the color is not the red found in the buckeye but a burnt orange or reddish orange color.


Tim