Brooder Questions

[nikkik0720]

So my fiance and I will be moving in May. We are finally going to be in an area where we can have chickens. I used to have 3 hens several years ago (still lived with my parents, and the vet clinic I worked at had several hens abandoned overnight in our kennel yard) (I had a speckled sussex, light brahma, and a tan hen who we never could pinpoint what breed she was).
Now that we're going to be somewhere that we can have chickens, we're definitely going to get some as soon as we get settled from moving. We'll probably be getting some mid May.
My fiance has no chicken experience. The girls I had before were already adults when I took them home, and I have limited experience with chicks. I had 6 bantam chicks for about 2 weeks before I realized I was in over my head and they went to live at my brother's in law's farm. (This was approx 12 years ago when I was 18, they were an impulse buy. I thought "how hard can it be", but quickly learned!) This time around, these chicks will be a planned purchase that I've had time to do research and educate myself. My fiance also has been doing research/reading up on chickens.
My question is about home-made brooders. He found someone online who uses a pop up pet playpen with pine shavings and a brooder heat plate. I have seen people recommend using a plastic tote with holes cut out/covered with hardware cloth.
We do have a 55 gallon plastic tote that's currently empty (used it for hay storage for a bunny we had, but she's since passed away). We also have her hutch/run that I think could work pretty well for a brooder.
I included a picture of it (picture's from amazon as the hutch is currently taken apart and in our garage). The ramp is removable, and there is a door that you can close/latch from the outside that goes up to the little house part. The wire spacing is small, similar to hardware cloth. And then I was thinking when they're a little older/more coordinated, I could always add the ramp back in and open the door to give them somewhere else to explore. I also figured I could attach the feeder/waterer to the wire sides so they don't spill it/knock it over. (My fiance thinks the waterer that has the chicken nipples would be a good idea) We would also cover the open sides of the runs with blankets/towels/cardboard/tarp for the first week or so if you think that'd be better. Or at least cover the sides where the heat lamp/plate would be to try to keep it warmer.
My other question is what do you think is better; a heat lamp, or the heat plates? And what type of waterer/feeder is preferred for chicks? Will the nipple waterer work for them, or is it better to have the type that has the shallow dish going around a jar? Same with the feeder? Is it better to have the longer ones, or the ones that have a jar attached that allows the food to gravity feed down into the dish surrounding it?
We are looking to get 5-8 chickens (but chicken math means we'll probably end up with 8-10) Would this be big enough for them? Even if its just for a few weeks until they feather out and we can put them outside? (Which I have another post on, because we want to convert a 10 x 10 metal shed into a coop and attach a large run to it)
Sorry for such a long post. I just want to make sure we're doing things right and have everything set in place/ready for when we do get our girls.

 

[Ridgerunner]

what do you think is better; a heat lamp, or the heat plates?

Where will this brooder be, in a climate-controlled building or outside subject to temperature swings. What will your weather be like when you get the chicks? I'm mainly interested in your possible extremes, hot and cold. The extremes are where your problems will be.

I do not like heat lamps in a climate-controlled area like your house. They heat the room and can overheat the chicks unless you have a lot of room. A heat plate would probably work better.

If you are brooding outside I'm a lot more comfortable with a heat lamp due to the temperature swings. But you need room. You need a warm enough spot in your coldest temperatures and a cool enough spot in the warmest weather. My 3' x 6' brooder is in the coop. In colder weather the temperature may go from below freezing to the 70's Fahrenheit in a day. My brooder is big enough and has decent ventilation so I can keep one end toasty in the coldest temperatures and the other end stays cool enough when it gets hot. n freezing temperatures I can put the water close enough to the heated area that it stays thawed.

Some heat plates say to not use them below 50 Fahrenheit. As long as it is not too cold they work great outside also. So which is better? Depends on the application.

And what type of waterer/feeder is preferred for chicks?

It depends on what you prefer. People use different things successfully. They have their own reasons for what they use. I use a black rubber dog type dish. I fill it with rocks so they can't fall in and drown. They will poop in it so I dump it out and change it daily or more often if required.

Same with the feeder? Is it better to have the longer ones, or the ones that have a jar attached that allows the food to gravity feed down into the dish surrounding it?

It depends on what you prefer. People use different things for their own reasons. I built one out of scrap wood that they cannot turn over but again they poop in it so I dump it regularly. But I do not overfeed so I'm not wasting food. I let them clean up the food before I add more.

If you use that rabbit hutch for a brooder I'd wrap the bottom in plastic to stop breezes from hitting them and use that lower level as the brooder. That 7.7 ft x 1.5 ft will be big enough for them until they feather out. Exactly how I'd do that would depend on your weather. That 55 gallon tote isn't that big for 10 chicks as they grow but you should make it work with a heat plate, at least for a while.

 

[rosemarythyme]

Hutch is a better option than a plastic tub, mainly due to ventilation. For 8-10 chicks the hutch (floor level only) would be sufficient for up to around 4-5 weeks.

We would also cover the open sides of the runs with blankets/towels/cardboard/tarp for the first week or so if you think that'd be better. Or at least cover the sides where the heat lamp/plate would be to try to keep it warmer.

Where would brooder be placed? If it's outdoors then a sheltered section where the heat plate sits would be a good idea. If it's not outdoors then draft is not an issue and I would not block up anything.

If using a heat lamp I would NOT have anything flammable added to the hutch.

My other question is what do you think is better; a heat lamp, or the heat plates?

If you're using the hutch, I would NOT use a heat lamp unless it's securely attached outside of the unit.

Heat plate may depend on what your ambient temperatures are in the location the brooder will be placed (some plates have a 50F+ recommendation).

A mama heating pad is also an option and will work at lower temperatures.

And what type of waterer/feeder is preferred for chicks? Will the nipple waterer work for them, or is it better to have the type that has the shallow dish going around a jar?

As long as the nipple is vertical, that's an option (horizontal requires more pressure to trigger so not suitable for very young chicks).

Same with the feeder? Is it better to have the longer ones, or the ones that have a jar attached that allows the food to gravity feed down into the dish surrounding it?

They both work pretty much the same. For 8-10 the longer one would probably give them more room to spread out, but it does need to be filled frequently.

 

[nikkik0720]

We live in Southwestern PA

Where would brooder be placed? If it's outdoors then a sheltered section where the heat plate sits would be a good idea. If it's not outdoors then draft is not an issue and I would not block up anything.

The brooder would kept either in the sun porch area of out house (fully enclosed, but no heat/cooling out there, other than windows) or in the garage (again, no AC, but it does have a wood burner/blower set up to keep it warm in the winter.

What will your weather be like when you get the chicks? I'm mainly interested in your possible extremes, hot and cold. The extremes are where your problems will be.

Over the winter, the temps got down to -40 F with the windchill outside. But the brooder wouldn't technically be outside. Our average winter temps are around 10 - 20 F.
Over the past summer, we had some really hot days, averaging around 90 F (without the heat index, closer to 110 F some days with the heat index). Our average summer, temps are around 80 F. Spring can be all over the place. For example last week we had one day that was 65 F, and the next morning it was 31 F and snowing. This week we have several days that have been in the 60's and 70's, but today they're calling for snow flurries overnight and we'll drop back down into the 40's.
We plan on getting the chicks at the end of May, so temps should stabilize a bit, and usually hover around 50-60 F with some days reaching into the low 70's.

If you use that rabbit hutch for a brooder I'd wrap the bottom in plastic to stop breezes from hitting them and use that lower level as the brooder.

As far as a heat lamp being secured, we would get one of the ones that are on a tri pod and put it so it hangs over one side.
If we use the hutch (which I'm 99% sure we will be) we would definitely cover the sides, at least until the chicks start getting their feathers in. We'd either use cardboard, or plastic tarps on the outside. We would take the ramp out and latch the top door inside so they wouldn't have access to it, at least not until they are older/more temp stable.
We plan on using pine shavings for the bedding in the brooder.

A mama heating pad is also an option and will work at lower temperatures.

What exactly is that? Just like a regular heating pad?

 

[Ridgerunner]

What exactly is that? Just like a regular heating pad?

I'll take this one as it's easy.

Mama Heating Pad in the Brooder (Picture Heavy) - UPDATE | BackYard Chickens - Learn How to Raise Chickens

 

[thecatumbrella]

I start mine in a 55 gallon tote in our living room. It's only good for about 5-7 days, then they need more room (we have a huge stock tank in the basement as a grow-out brooder). I cover everything with closet shelving. I should have a photo of our setup in my profile somewhere.

We start them on water nipples immediately (the yellow type that hang down, NOT the cross style which are too challenging for them to press). My absolute favorite feeder is the chick one made by RentACoop (link here). It's flatter than your typical chick feeder, and that prevents them from scratching the feed out. Once they're a few days old, I'll put it in a feeder harness and suspend from the shelving. Otherwise, they'll inevitable stand and poop on it.

 

[thecatumbrella]

Found the photo!

 

[Ridgerunner]

We live in Southwestern PA

The brooder would kept either in the sun porch area of out house (fully enclosed, but no heat/cooling out there, other than windows) or in the garage (again, no AC, but it does have a wood burner/blower set up to keep it warm in the winter.

We plan on getting the chicks at the end of May, so temps should stabilize a bit, and usually hover around 50-60 F with some days reaching into the low 70's.

It doesn't matter what the temperature is at the North Pole on Christmas Day. What matters is what are the conditions where the brooder is when the chicks are there. I suspect your lows could be quite a bit lower than that 50-60 where they sometimes hover. Some heat plates can handle that but I'd lean toward the heat lamp or heating pad.

As far as a heat lamp being secured, we would get one of the ones that are on a tri pod and put it so it hangs over one side.

Heat lamps can cause fires, especially if they are not used correctly. People can be hit by a vehicle even if they are not jaywalking. Not Jaywalking or using a heat lamp correctly can greatly reduce your risk. Heat lamps have been used for over 100 years for a lot of things other than keeping chicks warm. The husband of a forum member is a plumber. He uses heat lamps to keep exposed pipes from freezing during cold snaps. He relies on a chain to firmly hold it in place so it cannot fall. I use wire to hold mine firmly in place, not a clamp and not string or plastic string. Does a dog, cat, or child have access where they could knock it down? Secure it anyway.

If you check the CDC statistics, a small number of people die each year because of fires started by heating pads. Thousands of people are treated for burns caused by those pads. They are not without risk. Don't use one that is old and brittle. The wires inside can break and short out. I expect one in decent shape set up properly to be really safe.

I don't know what heat plates are used for other than keeping baby poultry warm. I can't find enough data on them to assess them. But I'd consider one set up properly to be very safe.

 

[nikkik0720]

It doesn't matter what the temperature is at the North Pole on Christmas Day. What matters is what are the conditions where the brooder is when the chicks are there. I suspect your lows could be quite a bit lower than that 50-60 where they sometimes hover. Some heat plates can handle that but I'd lean toward the heat lamp or heating pad.


Heat lamps can cause fires, especially if they are not used correctly. People can be hit by a vehicle even if they are not jaywalking. Not Jaywalking or using a heat lamp correctly can greatly reduce your risk. Heat lamps have been used for over 100 years for a lot of things other than keeping chicks warm. The husband of a forum member is a plumber. He uses heat lamps to keep exposed pipes from freezing during cold snaps. He relies on a chain to firmly hold it in place so it cannot fall. I use wire to hold mine firmly in place, not a clamp and not string or plastic string. Does a dog, cat, or child have access where they could knock it down? Secure it anyway.

If you check the CDC statistics, a small number of people die each year because of fires started by heating pads. Thousands of people are treated for burns caused by those pads. They are not without risk. Don't use one that is old and brittle. The wires inside can break and short out. I expect one in decent shape set up properly to be really safe.

I don't know what heat plates are used for other than keeping baby poultry warm. I can't find enough data on them to assess them. But I'd consider one set up properly to be very safe.

I know heat lamps can cause fires, even when used properly there is a risk. My brother's in laws (who have been raising chickens for 30+ years) had a small fire in their coop from a heat lamp, and they had plenty of experience with using them and used them properly. Thankfully his father in law was already out in the yard and smelled smoke and was able to put the fire out with very minimal damage.
And I know that heat lamps can be used for many things other than heating chicks, my dad owns an HVAC/plumbing company and uses them often. So I am very aware of the risks involved with them.
The heat lamp we're looking at is hanging from a thick chain on a tripod that has adjustable legs.
We do have 4 maine coons and a german shepherd. The cats will not be allowed in the sunroom when we have the chicks, since 3 of the 4 have high prey drives and would probably try to get the chicks. Even if they didn't try to get them, I would worry their presence could stress out the babies. Our german shepherd would be allowed in the room, supervised, as we want her to get used to the chicks and see them as friends not food. (Obviously she will never have access to the chicks, as babies or adults, since she is a herding breed and she also has already shown a lot of interest in my brother's birds when we're up there. So I wouldn't ever be able to trust that she wouldn't go after them and hurt them. I doubt she would go after them out of aggression, more so I feel like she'd try to herd or play with them and hurt them because she's a 75# dog who has no clue she's that big.
I have personally been burned by a heating pad as well, so I know the risks with them. And (not quite the same but similar) we had a space heater catch fire where the cord connected into the unit due to bad/old wiring. Anything that plugs in has a fire-risk with it.
If I were to use a heating pad for the chicks, I would be purchasing one to use strictly for them, as the one I currently have shuts off automatically after 30/60/90/120 minutes (depends on what you set it at)
Seeing as the hutch/brooder will be kept in an enclosed area, I'm thinking a brooder plate may be the option we go with since there won't be any drafts or drastic temp changes. We're thinking of keeping the brooder in the sun room until temps stabilize and we have lows that are constantly in the 60's, and then we'll move the brooder out into the garage. Which most likely they will be mostly, if not fully, feathered out and won't require a heat source.

 

[nikkik0720]

It doesn't matter what the temperature is at the North Pole on Christmas Day. What matters is what are the conditions where the brooder is when the chicks are there. I suspect your lows could be quite a bit lower than that 50-60 where they sometimes hover. Some heat plates can handle that but I'd lean toward the heat lamp or heating pad

And I understand that the temps only matter where the brooder will be. When I mentioned what the average temps were, that was in response to you asking what our extremes can be. When it's 50-60 out, lows usually hover around 40-50 depending on if it's raining or not.