Father/daughter mating. Should I let them?

[Unswydd]

If you do the math (not easy) the genetic diversity you lose with sibling mating is exactly the same as with line breeding (parent to offspring). Even ignoring the sex linked genes you are dealing with gene pairs, not really individual genes. I discussed this with one of the genetics experts that is no longer active on this forum because I did not trust my math. This is full siblings. Half siblings would be more diverse.

The reason breeders use line breeding is that it is easier to concentrate on specific genes. If you select the parent and offspring for specific traits you are more likely to get those traits to repeat with a parent/offspring cross.

I understand that if you select your breeding siblings for specific traits those traits also more likely to show up in offspring than from random crossings. You can still move forward toward your goals with sibling mating but line breeding has become the standard.


A standard way to develop a flock and maintain genetic diversity is to use line breeding to develop the traits you want. You are going to lose genetic diversity when you line breed. You want to eliminate the genetics that you don't want so you can more consistently get the genetics you do want. But if you get too inbred your flock eventually loses productivity, fertility, and disease resistance. Once breeders get to where they want with line breeding they often switch to spiral breeding to maintain sufficient genetic diversity and still retain those traits. Spiral breeding is where you put the chickens into "families" and you breed the families in a specific rotation. They carefully pick which chickens get to breed. You can look up the details if you wish.

Most hatcheries use a different method, the pen breeding system. They might have 20 roosters in a pen with 200 hens with random breeding. The pure randomness of that breeding maintains sufficient genetic diversity that they can go decades without having to bring in new blood.

Then there was the way Dad did it. His flock was one mature rooster and about 25 to 30 hens. He'd keep his own replacements for a few generations then maybe every ten years bring in fresh blood. I remember him getting a dozen Dominique and ten years later New Hampshire chicks from the feed store and keeping a rooster and a few hens. I don't know how much of that was his desire for genetic diversity or if he was just bringing in better breeds to upgrade his flock. His flock had a lot of game traits in it.

Thee are different ways to go about any of this. What is "best" is not always straight forward.

Okaaay....well, I'm not trying to get a certain breed I just have a couple of small pullets and a young cockrel that are siblings that one of my hens hatched. Just not sure if I want to keep the cockrel or not. Have 7 hens and a BO Rooster. He's quite a handful and tears up my girls backs pretty bad. He's rough. The cockrel mentioned is his son. He's quite handsome, cross Barred Rock and BO.

 

[Unswydd]

Not ideal, since they share more genetic similarity than any other combination. If you must, half siblings are better to breed than full

Ahhh, ok. Just re-read this and it clicked. The brother and sister are half siblings. Good, according to your post.

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Ahhh, ok. Just re-read this and it clicked. The brother and sister are half siblings. Good, according to your post.

Still wouldn't breed any resulting chicks back into the gene pool though if you have other options. I have multiple birds from a genetic bottleneck and it can be real hard getting out of those issues once they start popping up

 

[Unswydd]

Ok. So now I'm a little confused. If I shouldn't let siblings breed and also father daughter what's the point of hatching babies? I don't want to get a new Rooster every time he makes babies right?

 

[Florida Bullfrog]

Ok. So now I'm a little confused. If I shouldn't let siblings breed and also father daughter what's the point of hatching babies? I don't want to get a new Rooster every time he makes babies right?

What are your goals? Why do you want to breed chickens?

If all you want to do is expand your flock, let father x daughters/granddaughters/ and maybe even great granddaughters breed and let that be the end of it. That’s nature’s way.

You don’t want to breed full brother x sister unless you’re in mad scientist/Jurassic Park DNA engineer mode. Meaning you have a goal in mind to somehow change or enhance your birds’ genetics in dramatic ways. Its a natural way to substantially edit their genes. But its random and imprecise. You have to put a lot a thought into that kind of breeding and have a good eye towards knowing what to keep and what to cull.

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Ok. So now I'm a little confused. If I shouldn't let siblings breed and also father daughter what's the point of hatching babies? I don't want to get a new Rooster every time he makes babies right?

You just don't want to keep breeding resulting chicks back to their parents generation after generation

 

[SourRoses]

Jurassic Park DNA Engineer mode.

I want this to be a title we can get under our names, hehe.

 

[Unswydd]

What are your goals? Why do you want to breed chickens?

If all you want to do is expand your flock, let father x daughters/granddaughters/ and maybe even great granddaughters breed and let that be the end of it. That’s nature’s way.

You don’t want to breed full brother x sister unless you’re in mad scientist/Jurassic Park DNA engineer mode. Meaning you have a goal in mind to somehow change or enhance your birds’ genetics in dramatic ways. Its a natural way to substantially edit their genes. But its random and imprecise. You have to put a lot a thought into that kind of breeding and have a good eye towards knowing what to keep and what to cull.

Yeah, just for eggs and basically I just love the durn things! I enjoy taking care of them, watching my back, hehehe, and just observing their behaviors!
I do believe my arms have had enough pecking and biting by my Rooster, Popeye. He can be brutal at the most unexpected times. He is beautiful tho.
I do like chicks that I've raised tho, they're so much friendlier. I can't get near the ones Mama raised.

 

[RememberTheWay]

I want this to be a title we can get under our names, hehe.

Me too!