Is too much protein bad for adult Chickens ?

[dave_Cash69]

Quote:
agreed

 

[Wifezilla]

The bottom line is that the feed companies have spent thousands of dollars in research to find the optimal nutritional mix for the specific bird. If it was okay to feed all animals one feed they would not mix the hundreds of veriations that they do. They know what will maximize productive life and that is what they mix for. You should either buy a commercial feed meant for what you are feeding or you should match that nutritional balance as closely as possible. It is about more than just the protein. The game bird feed may be lacking a nutrient that is essential to your chickens; or it may have one that is toxic to them in the amount that is mixed into that feed.

Feed companies have spent MILLIONS of dollars trying to maximize their profits. Nutrition plays a role in figuring out how little they need to include in a feed before people stop using their product because their animals died. These feed companies are formulating their feed towards animals that will only be around for a few years at the most.

Chickens and ducks have been around for millions of years in one form or another. Commercially bagged feed hasn't been around for very long. How did we get chickens and ducks for all those years without Purina to help us out? By having them eat biologically appropriate food.

This commercial food vs natural food debate is one I have been involved in for quite some time. It started with my cats and the weight problems we had with Xena. It is also under great debate when it comes to the human diet. Which is better? Eating lots of grains ala the food pyramid or eating the diet humans evolved to eat? (Meat and fat with seasonal fruits and vegetables and no processed grains.)

Just keep in mind the people making commercial feed are the same ones that gave us melamine tainted grains in dog and cat food. They are also the same people who make your highly process, over heated extruded breakfast cereals.
http://www.nutritiondata.com/foods-008005000000000000000-w.html?maxCount=357
(Keep in mind that every 50g of carbohydrates = 1/4 cup of sugar)​

 

[colby318]

My two cents:
Breeder rations have more protein than layer rations. The better nutrition (not just the protein) helps chicks form in the egg. My rationalization is my hens deserve breeder since they and their potential future chicks benefit. I think layer rations is a minimum requirement to survive.

Colby in KY

 

[luvmygirlsinAK]

Quote:
Who in the world would ever give their chickens 70% protein?!!! I think this thread is going a little bit far-I don't believe anyone has suggested that anybody should give their chickens this much protein! Yes, I realize this was done from a study, but my goodness!!! 70%?!! This is such a far cry from the 20-24% or even 30% protein, that was mentioned earlier in the thread, and you're saying that because a person using 70% protein caused gout in chickens, your theory is that these people are going to shorten their chickens lives because they are using 20-30% protein?!!! O.k. I just picked my jaw up from off the floor.

That's an awful lot of protein for them to have to eat before they ended up getting gout!!

Edited for a typo.

 

[luvmygirlsinAK]

Even if earthworms and termites ended up being 60 to 70% protein, when combined with a chicken's other foraging, grass, weeds, leaves, kitchen scraps, etc. the total percentage of protein in a chicken's diet would not end up being 70% which is supposed to have caused gout in chickens in that study. 70% protein is extremely high, and I can't believe that anybody would ever even think about giving their chickens this much protein, and I'm quite sure this is not what wifezilla is talking about. We both believe very much in high protein, and I hope I'm not putting words in wifezilla's mouth, but we probably agree that a constant diet of 70% protein is extremely high for a chicken.

 

[sugarbush]

Luv
I was not suggesting that anybody would feed their chickens 70% protein. I was stating that the one study I know about on the effects of protein on birds found that it took 70% protein to give the birds gout. They did not determine what the longterm consiquences of high protein feeds on chickens would be because they caused gout like they intended and then killed the birds to disect them. 70% is what it took to cause gout in a short period of time....they also fed 16,20,30 % feeds for the same short period of time with no ill effects on the chickens accourding to autopsy. But this was a short term.

 

[sugarbush]

It is really too bad that protein content is not something that could be measured at home because this is a very interesting debate. If I could buy a test kit I would personnally allow some of my chickens to eat completely free range at different periods of the season and then measure the protein content of their crops. Just based on the poor laying paterns of completely free range hens I am positive that the results in grams would be less than 10%

 

[BaronRenfrew]

Hey folks: I'm getting a kick out of this thread, obviously i'm not the only one here with a pocket protecter somewhere.

Let me give you some agricultural truth: the greeks used to buy grain from the egyptians as they figured out for some reason their soldiers were healthier with grain from there than anywhere else. Farming was started on floodplains where seasonal floods added minerals to the soil (washed downriver from erosion somewhere).

The next farmers rotated their crops as they figured out this reduced diseases and pests and held better yields. e.g. year 1 grain, year 2 potatoes, year 3 peas or alfalfa, year 4 grain etc.

Today this doesn't happen. They grow one crop (corn) year after year and add fertilizer, herbicides, and pesticides by the ton.

Want to check the health of the diet of your birds? Easy: what colour is the yolk in the egg? The pasty yellow of cage kept chickens or the burnt orange of a free range bird?

 

[Lazy J Farms Feed & Hay]

Quote:
This is NOT true, while crop rotations in the Midwest look different today than they did in years past, for the most part the crop rotation is Corn-Soybeans for much of the Corn Belt. In the Eastern Cornbelt where I live the Crop Rotation on some arcres is Corn-Soy-Wheat-Soy depending on the farm.

There has been an increase in Continuous corn due to the recent increased profitability of corn partially due to the increase in Ethanol production, but many farmers are returning to a Corn-Soy rotation of some sorts.

Jim

 

[luvmygirlsinAK]

Quote:
I wasn't suggesting that you were suggesting that anyone feed their chickens 70% protein. I was making a statement that when studies are done, extremely high amounts of whatever the study is for are given to the chicken, person, rat, etc, and then causes everyone to get frightened that too much (which is always rediculously high amounts) will cause major problems if you give this person, etc. whatever has been tested. It is completely blown out of proportion usually and causes fear in the hearts of anyone wanting to use that product, or in this case a higher protein amount.

You already read my experience with gout, I'm sure, I'm just as possitive that it isn't high protein that actually causes gout, since I would only eat a bite or two of moose meat, and salmon, (just to make my mom happy) and this was long term. From the time I could eat ground up meat as an infant or whatever age my mom started giving me meat, until I left the house (when I started eating more meat) until I was 18 to go to college. So I really don't think that it is high protein that caused my gout.