Vent gleet, yeast infection, hard swollen abdomen, straining, lethargic

[CharlieBaby]

History
My two year old ISA Brown hen, Candy, has had persistent vent gleet for a few months. Other than a messy bum and slightly thin egg shells, she was acting normal. I added acidified copper sulfate to her water, bathed her, and gave probiotics last month, but the vent gleet continued.

Current symptoms
She has shown a rapid decline over the past three days, with the following symptoms:

• A very hard, distended abdomen
• Not laying
• Lethargic
• Squishy crop not emptying
• Loss of appetite
• Straining
• Sticky vent feathers

Other details
She has tried and failed to lay; I can't clearly feel an egg or specific matter when palpitating her abdomen or gently feeling inside her cloaca. Her eggs shells were thinner than usual before she stopped laying. I have not seen a lash egg. She is sensitive to me massaging or applying pressure to her abdomen. Her abdomen feels much harder than the ascites belly I have seen in other hens. When I pick her up, she makes a squirting sound and strains. She is pooping at regular intervals, brown solid poop with very watery white urates. Her crop is watery and squishy in the morning, but doesn't smell sour.

Diet
Last month, she and her flockmates transitioned from Kalmbach 16% Protein Flock Maintainer pellets to Nutrena Feather Fixer pellets. I offer their feed in dry and "mush" form along with fresh water, oyster shells, and grit. Very occasional treats include wheat grass, kale, dried mealworms, and plain coconut yogurt.

Suspected diagnosis
I paid for a fecal exam which ruled out parasites but showed "there were a fair amount of yeast, both 'budding' and 'non-budding'. This indicates multiple stages of development of yeast." I suspect she has a yeast infection that has spread throughout her body and may have triggered reproductive issues common for her high production breed (EYP, salpingitis, egg binding, cancer, impacted oviduct).

Current treatment
She is on day three of oral miconazole (cream), calcium, Baytril, and Epsom baths, but symptoms are worsening. I cannot afford additional vet costs, but I will do all I can to help her. The goal is to nix the underlying infection(s) and decrease abdominal swelling, if possible.

Other ideas to try
In addition to continuing with the treatment above (bolded), I'm considering:

• Adding nystatin powder (I have this on hand)
• Attempting to drain fluid from her abdomen (I know how)
• Trying an oral Epsom flush (read about in posts about vent gleet by @azygous)
• Adding meloxicam for inflammation (I have this on hand but am concerned about suppressing appetite)

Questions
Open to general input, too. Here are some specific questions:

1. Have you seen persistent vent gleet cause or trigger reproductive ailments such as EYP, salpingitis, or egg binding?
2. Can oral Epsom tubing be done any time of day? Is it okay to give when crop is slow to empty and abdomen is hard? Should food be withheld for a period of time?
3. Can powdered nystatin be mixed with miconazole cream? Can I deliver powdered nystatin in capsules?
4. Is an Epsom salt enema or any enema ever a good idea in cases of vent gleet and EYP, salpingitis, or egg binding to help expel potential egg material in abdomen?

Thank you for helping my sweet Candy.

 

[coach723]

What I see does not look like vent gleet, just runny droppings stuck to feathers. If the abdomen is bloated and hard that is usually a reproductive problem. Those can make it hard for them to push droppings out and result in messy butts. She may have salpingitis or other reproductive issue. Those can include cancers. The thin shells before she stopped could have been the beginning and could have set her up for infection. It's often very hard to know exactly until necropsy, sadly. Laying hens over the age of 2, especially those bred to lay lots of eggs, of which she is one, have a higher incidence of reproductive issues. It sounds like you have thrown the kitchen sink at it and nothing has helped, many of the reproductive issues they can get are often very resistant to treatment, or are not treatable. If you want to try to drain, that would answer the question if it's fluid or not. It doesn't sound like it is. Honestly, what I personally a do, is if reasonable treatments don't bring improvement, I leave them be and let them enjoy what time they have left, and then euthanize when they are obviously feeling unwell and not doing normal chicken things. I know that isn't what you want to hear. I'm very sorry. I think I would finish the meds you have her on now, and not add more.

 

[CharlieBaby]

Thank you for taking the time to respond @coach723. Your message reads like a voice of reason and hug — the exact combo I needed.

My husband and I decided to try to drain her abdomen tonight. We weren’t expecting much because she felt so solid, not like a water balloon which is what I think of with ascites. But she surprised us by releasing 300 mL of cider colored liquid. Do you know what this particular color might indicate?

Her crop is still very full of mostly liquid. She was spitting some of it up this afternoon. Yeast is a worry. We will see if things start to move through the night and she wakes up improved. You are probably right that an underlying reproductive disease is the main culprit.

I’ll update this thread tomorrow. Thank you again for weighing in during a tough time. I’ll be savoring every moment I have left with Candy.

 

[Eggcessive]

The fluid looks turbid which may be white blood cells or protein, but normally would be more clear. Be sure and give her some electrolytes to replace the fluid that she lost. Ascites or water belly can be a result of liver failure related to salpingitis and egg yolk peritonitis (coelomitis,) cancer, fatty liver disease, or more so in broiler chickens, heart failure. Draining can lead to infection or death, so not without a risk. I have only drained one favorite hen who had labored breathing. It helped her breathe, but she declined again in days, drained again, and was gone in 2 weeks. Normally I leave them alone and make them comfortable as possible. I’m sorry that your hen has this problem, but it is common in hens over 2-3.

 

[CharlieBaby]

The fluid looks turbid which may be white blood cells or protein, but normally would be more clear. Be sure and give her some electrolytes to replace the fluid that she lost. Ascites or water belly can be a result of liver failure related to salpingitis and egg yolk peritonitis (coelomitis,) cancer, fatty liver disease, or more so in broiler chickens, heart failure. Draining can lead to infection or death, so not without a risk. I have only drained one favorite hen who had labored breathing. It helped her breathe, but she declined again in days, drained again, and was gone in 2 weeks. Normally I leave them alone and make them comfortable as possible. I’m sorry that your hen has this problem, but it is common in hens over 2-3.

Thanks for your reply @Eggcessive. Some updates. Her crop is still massive and squishy like a balloon — bigger than yesterday. She’s drinking water but not eating anything, including favorite foods. Her poop has changed. She’s alternating between closing her eyes and looking around while not leaving her special kennel even with the door open.

We were giving Miconazole cream, calcium, and antiobiotic from Monday morning to Wednesday morning, but stopped last night and haven’t resumed because she was throwing up sour liquid when we opened her beak. Last night we drained her belly and that’s it.

I’ve wondered if I should keep trying to treat the yeast and give her time to turn a corner. Another option is to vomit her since we are out of options, but I think that would put her through unnecessary suffering. I keep asking myself, “What if I could clear the crop somehow?”

I called the vet and scheduled for Candy to be put down later today. I don’t want her to suffer more if she’s not going to get better. “Balloon” crop and ascites and being an ISA Brown with no appetite are tough odds, but 100% I’d cancel the appointment and keep fighting for her or simply give her more time if she might turn a corner.

I’m having a really tough time with this decision. Do you think taking Candy to the vet to be put down is a caring plan for her? @coach723

 

[coach723]

I'm so sorry. I think it's probably the best thing, the kindest thing you can do for her. I've found over the years that if YOU think it may be time, it probably is. It's never an easy decision, no matter the circumstance. When they stop eating, it's only a matter of time. You've tried everything, and nothing is helping, when they are suffering and we can't help them, then it really is a kindness. I know it's difficult, but sadly a necessary thing when you keep chickens. If necropsy is an option, that would let you know for sure what's going on and may bring peace of mind with your decision.

 

[Eggcessive]

I am sorry, but I’m just seeing your latest post. It may be easier for you if the vet puts her down so she doesn’t suffer. A necropsy by your state vet or at home could give you answers on what was wrong. If your vet is knowledgeable they might do that as well. I do just a brief one to view the abdominal contents, liver, intestines, oviduct, gizzard, etc. This video can help identify organs either now or in the future for doing a necropsy on a chicken:

 

[CharlieBaby]

I'm so sorry. I think it's probably the best thing, the kindest thing you can do for her. I've found over the years that if YOU think it may be time, it probably is. It's never an easy decision, no matter the circumstance. When they stop eating, it's only a matter of time. You've tried everything, and nothing is helping, when they are suffering and we can't help them, then it really is a kindness. I know it's difficult, but sadly a necessary thing when you keep chickens. If necropsy is an option, that would let you know for sure what's going on and may bring peace of mind with your decision.

I read your post just as I was pulling up to the vet yesterday. I was holding Candy and feeling so heavy hearted. Thank you, thank you, thank you for taking the time to send such a comforting and kind message. The vet echoed your thoughts and I was able to make a difficult decision knowing it was the most caring thing I could do for my sweet Candy given the circumstances. What an amazing burst of life she was in her chicken form, and how lucky I was to know and love her. The vet offered to perform a necropsy. I’ll share the results here in hopes of helping others who read this thread down the road. So grateful to connect with and learn from fellow “chicken peeps” on this forum. Wishing you and your flocks health and happy times @coach723 and @Eggcessive.
Edit: clickable videos

 

[Cj Tracker]

What I see does not look like vent gleet, just runny droppings stuck to feathers. If the abdomen is bloated and hard that is usually a reproductive problem. Those can make it hard for them to push droppings out and result in messy butts. She may have salpingitis or other reproductive issue. Those can include cancers. The thin shells before she stopped could have been the beginning and could have set her up for infection. It's often very hard to know exactly until necropsy, sadly. Laying hens over the age of 2, especially those bred to lay lots of eggs, of which she is one, have a higher incidence of reproductive issues. It sounds like you have thrown the kitchen sink at it and nothing has helped, many of the reproductive issues they can get are often very resistant to treatment, or are not treatable. If you want to try to drain, that would answer the question if it's fluid or not. It doesn't sound like it is. Honestly, what I personally a do, is if reasonable treatments don't bring improvement, I leave them be and let them enjoy what time they have left, and then euthanize when they are obviously feeling unwell and not doing normal chicken things. I know that isn't what you want to hear. I'm very sorry. I think I would finish the meds you have her on now, and not add more.

I've had the same going on with mine and posted questions. The hard front area but squishy bloat now. I am giving pain meds now. She actually has a healthy appetite. Even at 9pm i checked her and offered Greek yogurt with feed and oregano oil.
It's so hard. My first Isa Brown i lost around 3 yo and it completely broke me. She was the sweetest and best mom.

 

[Cj Tracker]

Please do let us know about the necropsy. My girl is hanging on, seems to want to live. I gave her water, food and pain meds tonight since she is very uncomfortable. I'm very sorry for your loss. These girls have quite loveable personalities, so hard to see them leave our lives. I've lost 3 in the past 3 months they were around 5 yo so longer than most but it crushed me nevertheless