Lymphoid Leukosis in Murray McMurray birds?

[RoostersAreAwesome]

@HollowOfWisps @nuthatched

I called Murray McMurray directly, and asked if they tested their chicks and/or breeder flocks for Lymphoid Leukosis. The customer service rep inspected all the certifications paperwork and said they are not tested according to what she could see/read. I spelled LL out for the customer service rep so I know we were talking about the same thing. I asked if there was anyone else I could talk to about this. She took a minute and came back to the phone, and told me she'd talked with the president of the company, and they do not have a requirement for their breeder flocks to be tested for LL. She said the president told her they consider it a type of cancer, not an illness, and NPIP, etc, does not require testing for this. With all the other testing Murray McMurray does I was really surprised and was hoping the breeders do it but it's just not listed. But if it's not a requirement, then the breeder flocks do not have to show proof of compliance, and therefore do not have to test.

As far as where I heard this, I've read several online reviews (yes, I know online review can sometimes be questionable, but these seemed pretty legit), including one on the Murray McMurray website where the owner had a bird autopsied and it had symptoms consistent with LL. I was not looking at a lab report for her bird, and who knows where the LL came from, but asking some questions about hatchery practices seems a reasonable thing to do. Owner assessment (again, online, and limited number of reviews, so grain of salt) of McMurray CCLs has been 50% positive and 50% negative from what I can tell, with the negatives being fragile, doesn't handle shipping stress well, deaths at 4 months and 6 months, or just after start of lay, etc. Could be due to a number of factors, and I understand it's a hatchery, not a breeder, but again, something to consider.

So I figured I'd poll folks here, and see what they've experienced and encountered with McMurray birds, and particularly the CCLs, especially with respect to LL.

I know there are several members on here that have diagnosed LL in their flock. Also, I'm having trouble determining how seriously I should be concerned, whether LL is pretty much everywhere and there's not much I can do to avoid it, and many folks have it without knowing?

I'm trying to figure out whether I should accept my chick order and assume things will be fine until proven otherwise, or if I should try and hunt up other breeders or hatcheries that test for this in addition to the large amount of testing McMurray does. McMurray pretty much tests for everything I am concerned about (that I know to be concerned about) except for LL. I originally placed an order with McMurray because I want their Whiting True Blues, and they're the only hatchery who sells them, and I figured while I was at it I could get a few more chicks and accomplish some breeding goals I had. If I have to source the CCLs elsewhere, it may take me another year to get them. Trying to figure out if the delay would be worth it.

From the certificate they emailed me for my order:
View attachment 3472386
From their website:
Check out their Biosecurity Page. Excerpt below

View attachment 3472395

50/50 reviews sound terrible to me. As someone who has Marek’s in my flock, if I could start over I would do anything to avoid Marek’s and the other diseases similar to it (like LL). Whatever ends up happening, please do not sell your birds if they contract LL.

 

[FunClucks]

50/50 reviews sound terrible to me. As someone who has Marek’s in my flock, if I could start over I would do anything to avoid Marek’s and the other diseases similar to it (like LL). Whatever ends up happening, please do not sell your birds if they contract LL.

Definitely not. That's why I'm concerned.

 

[Hucklekree]

Any cream crested legbars or whiting true blue in your flock?

Yes crested cream legbars. Still have all four and still producing (albeit much reduced from their first two springs)

 

[pugspigchicks]

Hatcheries are required to have regular testing for disease to keep their npip required to shop birds.
Npip would shut down the hatchery if the birds had LL, where'd you hear this? It sounds like hogwash.

NPIP doesn’t require testing for Mareks or AVL. It’s meant for PT and more recently PT and AI. MG is not required either. Just learned this the hard way as I have a necropsy confirmed visceral Mareks death in an allegedly vaccinated hen. The university Vet who performed the necropsy said the hen was exposed at a young age and not within the 3 months that I’ve owned her because visceral Mareks doesn’t manifest this quickly.