MJ's little flock

[RoyalChick]

Yes, that's the distinction I was making.

Something can be not at all virulent, like lung cancer in humans, but quite deadly.

Right.

So maybe I'm still in the dark about whether the more deadly form of marek's is also more contagious.

My understanding is that all strains of Marek’s disease virus spread readily. I have not read anything to suggest that they differ in that regard. The virus is carried in dander, and survives in dust in the earth for years.
The difference between strains appears to be in the rapidity with which it kills the chickens who contract the disease.
What I do not know is whether there is anything other than the individual chicken that determines the percent if exposed chickens who get the disease.
Age of exposure is another factor. Mortality is higher when exposure is at a young age.
The thing you need to consider is your existing flock and whether you can avoid them getting exposed.
In good news the vaccine is very effective at preventing symptoms and death. It does not prevent infection however. And vaccinated birds who catch the disease can be carriers. What that means in practice is that all chickens you introduce need to be vaccinated.
sorry for long response.

 

[MaryJanet]

My understanding is that all strains of Marek’s disease virus spread readily. I have not read anything to suggest that they differ in that regard. The virus is carried in dander, and survives in dust in the earth for years.
The difference between strains appears to be in the rapidity with which it kills the chickens who contract the disease.
What I do not know is whether there is anything other than the individual chicken that determines the percent if exposed chickens who get the disease.
Age of exposure is another factor. Mortality is higher when exposure is at a young age.
The thing you need to consider is your existing flock and whether you can avoid them getting exposed.
In good news the vaccine is very effective at preventing symptoms and death. It does not prevent infection however. And vaccinated birds who catch the disease can be carriers. What that means in practice is that all chickens you introduce need to be vaccinated.
sorry for long response.

Wouldn't the older hens already be exposed because Marek's is endemic? They would at least have picked it up from the wildbirds. But they're asymptomatic, so their immune systems are keeping it under control. That's not to say they've been previously exposed to Bernadette's strain of it.

All 3 of the pullets would have picked up Marek's at their previous home because they haven't been elsewhere, but only Bernadette is symptomatic. So maybe it's one of the less deadly strains? Would all three be showing symptoms if it were a deadly strain, because all three are youngsters?

 

[MaryJanet]

Hmmm perhaps it would be wise for me to euthanase the three pullets and deep clean their living quarters, by which I mean dig out and refill.

 

[BDutch]

My understanding is that all strains of Marek’s disease virus spread readily. I have not read anything to suggest that they differ in that regard. The virus is carried in dander, and survives in dust in the earth for years.
The difference between strains appears to be in the rapidity with which it kills the chickens who contract the disease.
What I do not know is whether there is anything other than the individual chicken that determines the percent if exposed chickens who get the disease.
Age of exposure is another factor. Mortality is higher when exposure is at a young age.
The thing you need to consider is your existing flock and whether you can avoid them getting exposed.
In good news the vaccine is very effective at preventing symptoms and death. It does not prevent infection however. And vaccinated birds who catch the disease can be carriers. What that means in practice is that all chickens you introduce need to be vaccinated.
sorry for long response.

There is one thing you forgot to mention. The immune system of chicks that eat organic feed is more resilient than the immune system of chicks who’s feed contains poisons.
They haven’t tested it with Marek, only with a kind of flu. But in the experiment the organic chicks healed faster than the ‘normal’ chicks.
Clue of the research: Chicks on ‘normal’ feed grow faster but struggle more with illness.
The report was withdrawn after pressure of the old school researchers/ farming industry. They even changed the original conclusion. And the new minister withheld funding for a larger scale research. According to a documentary of research journalists.
Source (in Dutch): https://www.bnnvara.nl/zembla/artik...gezondheidseffecten-biologische-voeding-nodig

 

[Down Under]

Hmmm perhaps it would be wise for me to euthanase the three pullets and deep clean their living quarters, by which I mean dig out and refill.

Ride it out, there is a good chance that your whole property is infected unless you changed your shoes and clothes between interacting with your different flocks (think clean room like the commercial flocks with tyveck overalls and new boots for each shed).

A few that have had chicken cancer (marek's) go through their flock have said that they only lost 5% to 15% of their birds and it effected the weakest ones the most, so to help them out a bit grab some lemon balm from a local nursery and let your chooks have a good munch on it.

 

[MaryJanet]

Ride it out, there is a good chance that your whole property is infected unless you changed your shoes and clothes between interacting with your different flocks (think clean room like the commercial flocks with tyveck overalls and new boots for each shed).

A few that have had chicken caner (marek's) go through their flock have said that they only lost 5% to 15% of their birds and it effected the weakest ones the most, so to help them out a bit grab some lemon balm from a local nursery and let your chooks have a good munch on it.

Shoes and clothes were and are changed between the two groups of hens. And I shower in between the two as well.

Otherwise there would be no point in calling it quarantine.

 

[RoyalChick]

Wouldn't the older hens already be exposed because Marek's is endemic? They would at least have picked it up from the wildbirds. But they're asymptomatic, so their immune systems are keeping it under control. That's not to say they've been previously exposed to Bernadette's strain of it.

All 3 of the pullets would have picked up Marek's at their previous home because they haven't been elsewhere, but only Bernadette is symptomatic. So maybe it's one of the less deadly strains? Would all three be showing symptoms if it were a deadly strain, because all three are youngsters?

I don’t believe Marek’s is everywhere. It is very common but there are plenty of flocks that have never had a sign of it.
I know for sure I have it in my soil but I don’t know that you can assume you do.
You could have a sample of the big girl’s coop tested.
It didn’t apply to me so I didn’t keep it, but I recall studies from India where sustained very high temperatures killed the virus in soil and you may get those temperatures. I will look for the study.
Also, I forget the name but can dig it up, there is a cleaner that has proven to kill Marek’s if you are planning on sanitizing where the little ones are. I got a bottle to sanitize chick stuff for use in the quarantine period it takes for the vaccine to take.

 

[RoyalChick]

Shoes and clothes were and are changed between the two groups of hens. And I shower in between the two as well.

Otherwise there would be no point in calling it quarantine.

Good for you.

 

[RoyalChick]

There is one thing you forgot to mention. The immune system of chicks that eat organic feed is more resilient than the immune system of chicks who’s feed contains poisons.
They haven’t tested it with Marek, only with a kind of flu. But in the experiment the organic chicks healed faster than the ‘normal’ chicks.
Clue of the research: Chicks on ‘normal’ feed grow faster but struggle more with illness.
The report was withdrawn after pressure of the old school researchers/ farming industry. They even changed the original conclusion. And the new minister withheld funding for a larger scale research. According to a documentary of research journalists.
Source (in Dutch): https://www.bnnvara.nl/zembla/artik...gezondheidseffecten-biologische-voeding-nodig

I can’t read the Dutch but am skeptical. Marek’s can kill a long time after the infection and few studies would keep chickens alive long enough to know if they got tumors.
Think of it like chicken pox and shingles. Once you have had chicken pox the virus stays in your system causing no problems and years later (actually with shingles it is decades later) it flares up as shingles.
With Marek’s a chick may survive the acute infection particularly if a less deadly strain, but later will die of cancer caused by the virus.

 

[MaryJanet]

Good for you.

Well, it's easy really. I've been doing the pullets first thing in the morning in my pjs, which go straight into the wash and I go straight into the shower. There are different gardening clogs for the different chicken groups so the shoes are also a non-issue.